evdreamer

Glenn,

Here is how the tail of a CPP should handle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWirrTJBdIs&feature=user He is using a G90 and the GWS motor that you ordered. Watching that I might bite the bullet and get a gyro and that motor.

Nick

evdreamer

Well I ordered a G90, that conversion kit, and a brushed ESC for the tail motor. I saw how to run seperates on the CPP on youtube, so I thought I would give it a try since I don't like the 3in1. Then I will put my brushless motor in if I like how it flies. Maybe some day I might be able to fly the CPP as good as Kyle Stacy does. Here is a link to the seperates video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_UnWXkEGhA

Nick

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

no flying today, was at the dmv like all day sucked lol, it was so busy there, picked up another battery for my cp pro, got a good deal on it, brand new for 12 bucks cant beat that at all, yesterday my cp pro was flying like a dream, loved every minute of it. hows everyone else doing?

rotarydoc

Hey Heli,

LOL, I hate going to the MVA here in Maryland, it's always busy and slow.

Sounds cool on the new battery, that is always a plus to have more batteries!

That is cool that you are making good progress with the CPP.....so glad to hear it!

I flew two packs tonight, it's getting dark earlier these days. I had a good flying session, even with just two packs (with the B400). I am working/concentrating on doing figure 8's in the uncomfortable (for me) direction. I am slowly getting there. I actually did about 4 in a row. They were slow, and not so smooth, but that will come with time. I also had a close call, the heli got a bit too close for comfort on one turn to my right. I knew the heli was too far to my right, but went ahead with the turn anyways, almost a really bad move! It was pretty close, but I didn't have to take cover or anything like that!

I haven't flown the Gaui in a while, need to bring it out one of these nice calm nights.

I am hoping that my DD tail comes tomorrow, along with the G110 gryo, so I'll have a project for the weekend.

Looks like I got Nick going on his CPP too!!!

It should be interesting to see how everyone does with their CPP projects!

Hope you get to fly soon, instead of standing around at the MVA/DMV !! LOL

Glenn

rotarydoc

Hey Nick,

Looks like we've been bitten by the CPP bug! That is cool that you ordered the stuff for your CPP too. I will be curious to see how your brushed ESC works out. I haven't had time to sit down and watch the setup yet, but I will.

Yeah, that CPP in the Youtube video sure is hovering nice, isn't it? The tail looks to be very well behaved, indeed.

I have not seen my DD tail yet, or the G110. Should be here tomorrow, I hope.

I flew two packs tonight, focusing mostly on figure 8's. I got about three in a row down in the hard direction. They weren't great, but better than last night's attempts. I had a close call too, I turned right when the heli was almost behind me to the right, and barely got it turned in time. A big whooosh, and some serious right cyclic saved it. I knew better, I don't know why I did that at the last minute. I read once that your moves should always be planned in advance, and now I can see why. I just did that turn on a whim...and it almost turned bad. But, no harm done. The B400 and me are fine.

I still wasn't flying high enough most of the time. Although, I did make an effort to fly high and make some turns at one point. Like you said, it's harder to keep oriented when the heli is high up, especially when it is close to being over your head.

Still, an overall good practice session, if a bit short.

Hope you got some flying in between school and what not.

Glenn

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

rotary you deff have to give us a update with the dd, if it works for you I will deff be ordering one, all I want is a longer last tail motor, is that alot to ask for lol

rotarydoc

Heli,

I will keep you updated, no problem. Keep in mind too, that Nick (evedreamer) is also doing the DD tail, and a G90 gyro, and I think he's also going to put a brushed ESC for the tail motor as well...should be interesting to see how it turns out.

I am hoping for the best. At least, like you said, I hope the motor at least lasts longer than the stock one!

Are you going to be able to fly some this weekend? Is the CX2 like totalled, or what? LOL

Hope you get some flying in...

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

Yeah all this talk about DD motors got me interested again. And when I saw the screws in the kit I thought I would try it again and go all out. Then I was also re-reading a RCHeli magazine were a person had the GWS motor and a G90 and said it was rock solid.

After I ordered the stuff I checked the products again and it looks like I got the last G90 and ESC.

In that video it looked like the person was learning to hover the CPP, but I was mainly looking at the tail. I checked a few of his other videos out and he was flipping the CPP over and over. Then after that I looked at my video of the CPP and the other video looked better.

It will be interesting to see how your new motor turns out. I think my problem before was trying to get the 3in1 gyro and my other gyro working good together. Hopefully the ESC should fix that problem since I won't need the 3in1.

Good to hear you got to fly. I only got one flight in today.

I might make a video of me assembling the new electronics on it and doing a test flight.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

I'll be sure and let you know how the motor works out.

The brushed ESC sounds interesting, but I'm not sure I understand exactly how it would work along with the 3 in 1, and the gyro all tied together. I guess I should watch the video on setup.

That would be cool if you made a video of the setup/install and test flights.

Hopefully my stuff will be here tomorrow.

Have a nice evening. Gotta work tomorrow, so I'm out of here.

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

With the brushed ESC I don't need the 3in1. The only thing I needed it for in the past was the mixing of the main and tail motor. From what I understand I need to plug the gyro into the rudder channel of the receiver. I have an idea of what to do with the ESC, but I can't explain it since the picture of the ESC isn't that clear. But I need a Y-adapter from the battery to go into the main motor ESC then the other goes into the tail ESC. Then I take the signal wire from the gyro and plug it into the ESC. I am assuming it will be the throttle wire of the ESC.

EDIT: I found a better picture. So it is the throttle wire I am talking about. I need to unplug the red wire on the throttle lead of the ESC, so it doesn't mess up the BEC on my other ESC. http://www.gws.com.tw/english/produc...troller/50.htm I got the ICS50 and I am going to have to disable the low voltage cut off since it was meant for NiMh batteries. Then I also will have to add full left rudder to arm the tail ESC.

Nick

evdreamer

Glenn,

I took apart some of the T-Rex to oil the bearings. It is much easier than the Belt CP to get to the bearings, because I would have to take the whole Belt CP apart to get to some of them. And pretty much all the bearings are exposed on the T-Rex without having to take it all apart.

Then I put the new upgraded dampners in because my stock ones were already wearing out after 10-20 flights. I have heard these new ones last a lot longer. They are stiffer than the stock ones, so the cyclic response might increase. I will just have to wait until the thread lock cures.

I flew a pack with the CX because I wanted to see how it flew after sitting on the shelf for a long time. I put Tri Flow in all the bearings and the rotors spin a lot longer than with the 3 in 1 oil I was using on the CX.

Hope you get to fly today.

Nick

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

prob wont get any flying in today, just got home from work and im reall tired, hopefully tommorrw I will, nah the cx2 isnt to badly damaged, the flybar was bent so I bent it back to straight or as much as I could, replaced all the blades and landing gear, and just picked up a new canopy at the lhs, I think what made it looks so bad was the broken canopy, there was basically nothing left to it lol, do you still fly the quark often rotarydoc?

rotarydoc

Nick,

Sounds like heli maintenance day for you!

I should probably do the B400 bearings before long too.

My CX2 needs an inner shaft, last time I flew it, it had a horrible vibration. I am just too lazy to get one and put it in.

Yeah, stiffer dampening should make the cyclic more responsive, see how it goes...

Now you have me thinking about an ESC for the new tail motor. I would just be doing the tail motor ESC, not the main motor.

So, let me see... it would go something like this; I would need to power the ESC off of a "Y" from the battery...and then the gyro would go to the rudder channel on the RX, then the ESC lead would go to the gyro, and then the ESC motor leads would go to the tail motor?

I know my LHS has some inexpensive brushed ESC's in stock...I am thinking about trying that, and bypass the 3 in 1 alltogether for the tail motor...what do you think?

Heli, yeah, I do fly the Quark from time to time, but not if it's windy, as it gets pushed around a bit. I am saving it for mostly flying in the shop at work when the days get shorter, and I can no longer fly after work. I don't want to put too much wear and tear on it until then.

The Gaui is a bit more fun to fly outdoors, to be honest. It has alot more power and can do more stuff than the Quark. I still love the Quark though, nothing beats it for just plain FUN!!

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

I just got done flying with the new dampners and it doesn't seem too much different. The main thing I want is to have the dampners last a long time.

Then with the brushed ESC you need to take out the red wire on the throttle pin, since the 3 in 1 has its own BEC. Then I am assuming you need to turn the proportional potentiometer all the way counter clockwise, so you get the full power out of the 3in1 for the main motor. Then I am guessing that when you don't plug the rudder wire from the 3in1 to the receiver the gain on the 3in1 won't do anything. Right now I am kind of going by how the manual explains how to hook up the brushless ESC, but applying it to the brushed ESC. The rest of what you said is what I am planning on doing. I think it would be simpler doing this than trying to run the tail motor off of the 3in1. It seems more like a belt driven set up and easier for me to understand. The only difference is there is no tail servo and the motor takes that place and goes into the gyro.

I guess we both will figure out if this works or not. Did you get your motor yet?

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

Just got home and the tail kit is here.

I am very surprised at the size of the tail rotor!! They gave me two of them, actually. They are TINY compared to the stock CPP tail rotor....I guess because the motor is much higher RPM?

I also noticed that it looks like it mounts the motor on the opposite side as the stock setup...I'll have to do some thinking on which way the tailrotor needs to turn!!

I think there are some instructions on the website somewhere?

At first, I thought there were no screws with it..but they are already threaded into the motor.

Is your tail blade that small?


Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

Here is the link to the instructions http://bladecprepair.com/man_tr_dd_conversion.html

Yeah on the videos of the DD motor I have noticed that the motor mounts on the other side. It seems like it would be easy to convert the CPP into a European helicopter, since the tail rotor is on the other side. Then you could reverse the motor direction and flip the blades to the opposite side. It might be more complex than that, maybe you would have to flip all the head components 180 degrees so it is still a trailing edge control.

Yeah my blades with my current GWS motor are smaller. The person who did the conversion in RCHeli magazine made the landing gear and the tail support shorter to lower the helicopter.

Four more days and I will have my parts.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

Thanks for the link, that should help alot. I still have not gotten my gyro, but it should get here tomorrow.

It's going to take some figuring out, since I don't want to install the rotor blade until I am sure which direction it goes. I think the blade is hard to get back off of the tail motor once you install it?

We'll see. I am still not sure about the brushed ESC yet...I did watch the video on separates. I may hold off on the ESC, and just try the DD motor setup first.

That, and this time I am going with the Eflite blades, they are much lighter, and I think that is part of what was messing me up before. When I would throttle up, it would kick the tail out really bad, I think because it was taking so much power to accelerate the heavy blades, then the big counter rotation effect took over. I am also going to run a good bit of headspeed, and not worry so much about how well it hovers. I was stuck on that for a while there. Probably because back in the day, I had to fly it in the shop mostly, and I needed it to be stable in there.

My tailboom has a huge glob of CA on it...from constantly glueing the tailbox in place. I think I will chop the end of it off to give me a new start, and to move the CG forward some.

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

When I try the brushed ESC I will let you know how it flies. Too bad you don't have your gyro today, so you could test fly it.

I ordered some symmetrical E-flite blades with the motor, but I am going to test it out with my plastic ones before I put the blades on. Last time I experimented I crashed and broke my wooden blades.

I am going to try using the stock tail motor holder since I already trimmed it for the GWS motor.

Nick

evdreamer

Glenn,

Looking at the instructions on bladecprepair it looks like the curved part of the rotor faces the motor with the tail blade on the left side of the helicopter.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

I just got done rebuilding the B400 after a minor crash. I found a VERY COOL new place to fly...have been thinking about flying there for a while now, but never tried it out. It is a horse racing track, about a mile from my house. I road test cars there all the time for work, and got to looking at this one area...it's very large, open, and a grass field. There is parking right there too, so I can just pull the car up and unload the heli and stuff.

It seems too good to be true, and it might be. They constantly have security trucks driving around there, so I am not sure if they will hassle me for flying there or not yet. I will keep flying there until they tell me I can't...

What a difference having some REAL space makes!!! Man, I was doing HUGE figure 8's, and circles, banked turns, and even some figure 8's the hard way...I easily flew farther, faster, higher, and smoother than I ever have before!! At one point, I had the heli way up there, at least 60-70 feet, I would say (it might be less, it always seems higher). And doing some really cool high speed banked turns as well...had a BLAST flying there tonight!

But, it got cut a bit short, I was doing stupid stuff. With all that room, I was practicing some slow left turns, as usual, to my left, and just lost altitude, and it dove lightly into the grass. No biggie, about $8 worth of parts.

I can't wait to go and fly up there again!! It would also be a great place to fly the Gaui too.

Let me send this, and I'll be back...

Glenn

rotarydoc

Nick,

Yeah, I was looking at that picture of the tail blade too, but mine looks different. I will just have to see when I get to that point. I am not sure if I should hook the motor leads up with correct polarity, or reverse, since the motor is mounted on the other side...

Hey, I know what I was going to ask you...can I remove the satellite reciever (auxillary, or whatever) from the AR6200 and use it as a normal single receiver? I see no need for the extra receiver for a short distance application like the CPP?

I am also planning on using a set of symmetrical blades when I try out the new setup.

I am going to start with the CPP by writing down the servo reversing, and swash mixing direction, and do a complete reset on the DX6i, and start over from scratch.

I may go up to the LHS and look at the small brushed ESC's and see how much they are and what it looks like it might entail to install one. I guess I would need some JST connectors to make the battery/power connections.

I don't know, maybe I'll just try the DD motor as is first, and kinda get a feel for it. I am thinking it's going to take some dialing in on the DD motor and gyro anyways.

I will probably start with the basics on the CPP tonight...and see how far I feel like going...

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

It sounds like you found a very cool place to fly.

It is good to hear the crash wasn't a major one.

Couldn't you just connect the motor wires with the same polarity then if the motor spins the wrong way you could just flip the connector on the 3in1 so negative pin goes to the positive wire on the connector? Then vise versa for the positive pin.

I have heard that a couple of people fly without the satellite receiver on the AR6200 and it works ok for them.

I am also going to redo the programming on my transmitter for the CPP.

Have fun if you start to work on the CPP.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

Yeah, it is a very cool place, but I don't know if it will last. I'll sure keep flying there until they tell me I can't!

Yep, just a little crash, just a stupid crash. At least I didn't crash doing figure 8's or banked turns at high speed...LOL

Yeah, I guess I could just connect the tail motor connector the other way around, I guess it will go in either way, never tried it before.

I can't see the need for the satellite receiver at close ranges like the CPP will be...so I'm gonna try it without it, and see how it goes.

Let me go get the CPP and dust it off...LOL

Glenn

rotarydoc

Nick,

Well, the tail motor connector will go the other way around, so that is one issue not to have to worry about.

Just so you'll know, I just tried the AR6200 without the satellite receiver, and I couldn't get it to bind without the satellite receiver hooked up for some reason. I guess it needs to see it to bind. I am just going to leave it connected, it's no big deal, I have a good mounting place for it anyways.

I just reset the radio, and got all the servos at 90 with some subtrim. The swash is a mile off. I am going to call it a night for tonight on the helis, going to watch TV for a while.

Talk to you soon,

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

There are some maintenance people at the baseball field I fly at and I worry they might tell me not to fly there either. But like you said I am also going to keep flying there until they tell me not too.

Speaking of dust I didn't realize how much dust was on my CPP and CX. I cleaned them both and now they look like new.

Nick