J-MICHAEL

Nick ~


Yeah throw up that link to the plane calculator ! I could use that, and it would help with my understanding some more in that dept. I've been addicted to flying one of my CPP's lately and that has taken up my time so far for the last few days. I sure love the CPP's ! Now I know why Helistyle likes them so much... I agree also... A fun little machine. Because my yard is small I'am just loving it lately ! Trying to practice my rightside hovers and nose-in... Nose-ins are kinda hairy, and the stock CPP doesn't help much.

Yeah Nick I was surprised to hear of your VERY short flight times on your plane. That's crazy huh ? I think that's the lowest I've ever came across ! Usually the planes will get ya some good times more than the heli's. That's why I would love to tinker with that calculator I guess...

When you have to bring it in to land at a fast approach does it get kinda hairy ? With the size of your elevator flaps, I bet in time you'll be able to slow the decent and come in kinda like a half-Harrier, half hover type of thing if ya know what I mean. Don't know the terminology much... LMAO... But my Typhoon also has the oversized flaps, and I used to be able to just about hover it in for a landing in a Harrier mode fassion. Try it sometime... Or on the sim... Gas and flap it, and it should do all that fine. I'am curious... Dang I miss flying my planes. I think the Funtana will be a blast, but I need to put the darn thing together ! I might have forgot how to fly !



Gotta run Nick, chat later......

~ Jeff

evdreamer

Jeff,

It is called MotoCalc and here is the link. http://www.motocalc.com/motodown.htm I am just using the 30day free trial and got all the info I need for LiPo and A123 setups on the 540.

The plane weighs 3.5lbs, so that is about double the weight of my 450 and I was pretty much going full throttle with a 3S 2100mAh battery. Then the FP batteries are old and I am guessing it doesn't have the capacity that they used too. Then based on the calculator a 1/3 of the energy is wasted with my current prop.

My first few attempts at landing were hairy and the plane bounced a little. Now when I turn on the flaps to land it is pretty easy and I can usually stop it pretty close to me. Right now I can't do what you are talking about with landing. I tried to do that in the air, but I don't quite have the power and throws to do it. It will stall right before it is vertical and drop the nose really quick.

Nick

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

do you guys know if the futaba t6exa fm 6 channel radio can be used on a helicopter. On the radio it says airplane radio

evdreamer

Helistyle,

Does it have a CCPM option?

Nick

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

you mean a swash option (ccpm)?

it does not

evdreamer

Helistyle,

Collective Cyclic Pitch Mixing. Then you can't fly modern helis with it. You might be able to fly older ones that have mechanical mixing like a Thunder Tiger Raptor 30 and up.

Nick

J-MICHAEL

Nick ~


That's right, I forgot your running only the 3s batts... My bad... Makes all sense now... (LMAO). Yeah wait until ya get her all dialed in... Those Edge's are known to pretty much do anything a pilot can throw at it. Awesome... That Calculator is very cool ! Thanks for the link for sure.

I just got home, and so I'am getting ready to go and play outside with the CPP.... [8D] I got her down to 294 grams so far, and still when I have time I need to gut her some more. From the last video about a week ago, I lost 10 grams since that flight. It flies so much better with the CF tail rotor cut shorter about 1/2" total, and the CF boom cut 1" shorter also. I cut off 1" on the skids, to slam it down, and can adjust the tail rotor in the back with the little piece of fuel tubing. I took the inner flybar weights off that secure the flybar, and removed the hardware from the paddles. I also shaved off some from the paddles which are just to heavy for this stock CPP. About 1/2 a gram so far total from the paddle weights. Vented the 3 in 1 also... Flying around last night in the yard, this thing is starting to get tuned in better than it ever has... So fun ! Eventually I'll grab the CPP2 motor and tail set-up possibly.



Take care,

~ Jeff

evdreamer

Jeff,

I just ordered some smaller shrink wrap and the prop recommended my motocalc, so I will see how accurate it is. Then I will be using the same regulator that is on my 600 with this plane and use my Outrage 2S 800mAh batteries as a receiver battery. Now all I will be flying with are A123's!

Have fun flying the CPP.

Nick

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

damm thats a no go then on the transmitter :/

glenn do you have two sets of flybar weights still on the flybar of your cp pro 2?

rotarydoc

Heli,

That's a shame on the radio, must be an airplane only radio then...[]

Nope, I'm just running the stock 1 flybar weight per side, both of my CPP2's now are still totally stock.

I had CF blades on the one, but that is history now with that one major crash...so they are both identical, (and hard to tell apart..lol) and totally stock.

Glenn

evdreamer

Jeff,

You might find this interesting. I got all my meters out (Tach, wattmeter, temp gauge) and was adjusting the settings on my Phoenix-60 for my plane. The first one I adjusted was the break and increased that to see what happened. I thought once I cut the power the current would flow backwards with the break enabled and my wattmeter showed that. So my motor was charging my battery. Then the next one was the frequency. I started at the default 12KHz and at 4000RPM's it drew 7A. Then I went to 16KHz and at 4000RPM's it drew 6A. Then I went to 24KHz and at 4000RPM's it drew 5A, so I was getting the prop to spin at the same speed, but with less current. I also adjusted the throttle response and the startup power, but those aren't as interesting. It is a lot of fun to adjust all these things. If I had a laptop I would be at the field messing with this more. I think a Eagle tree datalogger would be a cool tool to see what is going on with this in more detail.

Nick

J-MICHAEL

Nick ~


That's cool ! I still have that small paragraph that I saved from ya awhile back when you gave me some testing info on the 450 and with that KHZ and how it affected the power output. Yeah that's very interesting... I sometimes will try different settings with the KHZ, but don't have the right tools to test, and the know how like you... So thanks for that. Yeah I guess an Eagle Tree would be nice now that I think about it.

Cool on the A123's for the 540 now !!! Now the party will begin... You just got a little taste, and that's it ! LMAO... That thing sounds like so much fun. I really like the size...

HeliStyle

My Feedback: (2)

yeah i wish I could have used the radio, all well lol

evdreamer

Guys,

It was pretty windy at my little demo today. My 540 was flying pretty good, but I had a hard time landing in the 10+MPH wind. So the landing was kind of hard and pushed one of the landing gear up into the frame and cracked part of it. I hope a little CA will fix that. I then tore apart one of my helicopter batteries and soldered them end to end for the 540. I think I have a few cold solder joints, but I can't get them apart now. I put silicone on one of them and ran out of room to put it on the other battery. Hopefully I will be able to fly with these early next week.

rotarydoc

Nick,

Sorry to hear about your hard landing, hope some CA will fix it up....I am guessing that the frame is wood of some sort? LOL, I don't know squat about planes, except that some are foamies, and some have wooden frames and such...

So you are going to build your plane packs all in a row, like cells butted togther pos to neg? That sounds like it might be a PITA to assemble those packs like that...

I just got back from flying, flew the main B400, and the 450 Pro...they fly quite a bit differently, and each takes a minute to adjust to it's flight characteristics...but it's good practice. I have been lucky, got the one close baseball field to myself most all week, and the weather has been awesome for July, it's like 75 with no wind tonight...I got in a total of 7 packs today.

Hope you can get everything ready by early next week, like you said.

Did you fly the 600 at the demo as well?

Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

Yeah my plane is made mostly of Balsa wood, which isn't too strong. Then there are small amounts of other types of woods in key spots. I can't crash this plane because most of the parts aren't available until late July to September. I just like the helis because they use screws and small parts and not clue and huge assemblies like planes, but the planes are kind of fun. Flying them isn't the hard part it is landing them.

Yep. It wasn't too hard. I just put solder on some tin strips on both cells. Then I tried to melt both of them and stick it together quickly. The first couple of times I don't think I got the second one to melt when I stuck them together. It wouldn't be hard to take them apart if I didn't cut off the little lip that goes over the cell side in the past. I will get some pics of it when I am done. I test fitted it in the 540 and it fits just fine. It will end up being a 6S pack. Based on motocalc it will outperform the best LiPo setup.

That is cool that you got to fly today and have been having good weather. It has been hot and humid here, but probably nothing like what Evan has.

Yeah I flew the 600 at the demo. I fly with another guy who flies big gas planes. However, this was his last time out there, since he got a day job. Then no one from my club wants to go out there or can't because they have day jobs. Anyways we explain what goes on with our aircraft and answer the kids questions. One of the things we ask them is if a helicopter can fly upside down. Most of them don't think one can and are pretty suprised when I do.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

Glad the damage to the plane was not major, and hopefully you can fix it OK with some CA or wood glue...

I have watched some guys land at my field, and it seems pretty hairy, especially if there is a crosswind, which there almost always is at my club field.

Good luck on the battery pack build, sounds kinda difficult to get those cells assembled in a line like that...I wonder if you could set the cells side by side, then solder the tin strips to each one, and then fold the one cell on top of the other one? I can't picture what you are trying to do exactly, so it's hard to say...

I have been really lucky lately on the weather, the evenings especially, I got in another 7 pack day today. I am flying the 450 more now, getting more of a feel for it, which is easy, because it flies so well. It really does fly like a larger heli than it is, makes the B400's seem squirrelly....

I measured the motor temp today, and it was about 145 after a flight, so that's pretty warm, but not too awful hot, I guess. The motor bearings seem to be holding up fine so far...

It's supposed to be kinda hot and humid tomorrow here, more like normal for July. So I'll see how much flying I can get in. I should get up early and go fly before it gets hot and windy (JPEE, early is like 11AM...LOL)..

Hope you can get some flying in this weekend, and be careful with the plane, I know how you feel, back when the CPP2's were new...

Cool that you got to put on a little show again for the kids...sounds like they enjoy it...


Glenn

evdreamer

Glenn,

I like landing helis more, since you can take all the time you want to land. Then with a plane I have to commit to it and hope for the best.

I just put the main leads on one battery and only have to put on the balance connectors. I think my shrink wrap should be here tomorrow or Monday then I can finish them up. I got some Silicone on my second battery and I am waiting for that to cure. The battery is 3 cells end to end and 2 wide and all in series.

That is cool you have been having good weather and flying a lot. It has been hot and windy lately. Sunday evening looks like a half way calm time to fly.

I looked at my Align 650 motor today and the windings are purple. I am glad I stopped flying with that motor. I also noticed my Tonic-x motor has a 12 pole stator, which I thought was interesting. Usually helis use 9 pole and airplanes use 12 poles.

Nick

evdreamer

My parts came for the 540 and I just got done charging one of the 6S packs. Since it is too windy to fly I am going to make a big database on the specs of my 600 and 540 motors in 1V increments up to 40V.

evdreamer

Glenn,

Here is a picture of my 540 battery.

Nick

rotarydoc

Nick,

Cool on the 540 parts....and the battery packs look awesome, nice job!

I was thinking that they were in a straight line, like a long flashlight would use...that makes more sense now that I see a pic...

Looks good, I see the silocone in there holding the cells in place...nice work.

Yeah, been windy as heck here too...and it doesn't seem to be letting up, getting cloudy, looks like rain. Probably won't get any flying done today, have to be satisfied with the sim. The new models and sites on Phoenix are making it more interesting....the Rave, T-Rex 250, and the Logo 500 are interesting...Jeff, there is a super-duper Logo 500 on Phoenix, it's a 550? with longer blades, etc....has incredible performance, blows the Trex 500 away in power and handling...I'll have to see what it's exactly called, they offer 3 versions, and that one is pretty amazing.

I was reading a bit on sims last night on HF, Phoenix in particlular, and they were having an interesting debate on how visible a rotor disc should be on the sim, compared to real life. And then the conversation went on about how different color blades affect the rotor disc visibility in RL, vs on the sim...

Anyways, I'll be back later on....

Glenn

evdreamer

Jeff,

I just got done getting the data on my 540 motor and it seems to perform best on Low timing with 24KHz. I kept the frequency constant and changed the timing and the Output Power difference is about 1.7% from low to high timing, but that is only .12W of a difference. That was at a low throttle, since I had a hard time getting the same motor Voltage with different settings. Once the current goes up the low timing makes more Output Power, since it wastes less energy. Then there is about 1.56W difference between 12KHz and 24KHz. Then there is a .5% difference between 16KHz and 24KHz.

Nick

evdreamer

I just put my new prop on and I am making 650W and 80W more than motocalc predicted. That puts me over the 150W/lb needed to do 3D. I am also making 250W more than my 3S LiPo setup. I just hope this prop can perform, since it is 5in smaller in diameter than my previous one.

evdreamer

Glenn,

That is cool that you have more models and sites to fly on Phoenix.

Nick

evdreamer

I just got the specs on my Scorpion 4025-740 and it is almost 95% efficient! No wonder why I can fly longer. It sounds pretty cool with out the blades spinning. I could hear massive amounts of air getting blown around.