pgroom_68

Hey again Erwin,

Thanks mate! That clears that up nicely! Brushless setups ARE a diff. thing for me to try to understand now

Peter[sm=49_49.gif]
P.S. Fernando will be pleased that he doesn't have to buy another 3in1 to replace his dodgy one now

retired92

Hello All;

Peter,
In RC Heli magazine, August 2009 issue, there is an article entitled "Inside an ESC". If you have trouble finding this mag send me an e-mail and I will make copies for you. I hope I am not violating any rules with the direction to the magazine. read all later....Don

Beachcomber

Hi guys. I might not be following this discussion correctly, but offer the following;

1) If you're talking about voltage to the stock 3-n-1 when installing the new brushless motors/speed control kit, the drawing I got with mine (got the kit from the E-Bay source and still waiting for pinions) show the stock 3-n-1 connected from the battery in parallel to the two new brushless speed controls. So in this case the stock 3-n-1 still sees full 11.1V.

2) If you're talking about eliminating stock 3-n-1 and going complete separates, I don't see anything on the brushless speed controllers or literature that indicated it can provide BEC type power. So unless someone can verify, I'd be wary.

erdnuckel2

I have no idea, if that will work, but here is the thing: brushless ESC usually have a BEC, the ones with enough power for the motors we talk about here, at least 1A, more often 2A.

from the aeorc website: http://www.aeorc.com/english/syssite...1232421197.jpg (i really hope, this link will work)

Sven

RC_Addiction

FROM BEACHCOMBER:
Hi guys. I might not be following this discussion correctly,[[[ l'd recommend you read all recent posts, we r talking about possible 3-in-1 elimination]]] offer the following;

1) If you're talking about voltage to the stock 3-n-1 when installing the new brushless motors/speed control kit, the drawing I got with mine (got the kit from the E-Bay source and still waiting for pinions) [[[YEAH I BOUGHT THE SAME KIT FROM SAME SELLER ON EBAY "Flying Meercat" but didn't want to wait for pinions so used the stock ones, drilled a hole through them]]] show the stock 3-n-1 connected from the battery in parallel to the two new brushless speed controls. So in this case the stock 3-n-1 still sees full 11.1V. TRUE BECAUSE THE 3-IN-1 DOES THE CONVERTION TO LOWER VOLTAGE TO THE OTHER COMPONENTS BUILT-IN THEM.

2) If you're talking about eliminating stock 3-n-1 and going complete separates, I don't see anything on the brushless speed controllers or literature that indicated it can provide BEC type power. So unless someone can verify, I'd be wary. CHECK THE DIAGRAMS I POSTED A FEW POSTS AGO.

from Peter:
P.S. Fernando will be pleased that he doesn't have to buy another 3in1 to replace his dodgy one now AFTER THE TESTS I'M GOING TO DO IN A FEW MORE MINUTES I WILL DECIDE EITHER TO GO SEPARATE PARTS OR ORDER ANOTHER 3-IN-1

FROM BER60:
A warning with the BL setup: only 1 esc can deliver the 5V to the RX the other esc's red/positive/+5V lead should be removed NOW THAT WOULD CHANGE MY ITCH FROM GO SEPARATE PARTS !!! DON'T WANT TO END UP BURNING EVERTHING ELESE HAHAHA!!

read you guys around!

RC_Addiction

Ok, after adjusting my 3-in-1 to a flyable state, these are my personal conclusions and observations:



FLY TIME: About the same, 1 minute or so more than with the xtreme motors.

POWER: Slightly more throttle power

LOOKS: Bulky, no too bad compared to when using the Dual brushless converter and other slightly different setups i've seen.
I found these BL conv's are just fine and less bulky than [link=http://www.kraehe-electronics.net/2BLC.html]THIS ONE[/link]

FLYING
FEEL
OVERALL: Heli feels more responsive, heli tends to turn CW when given more throttle (i blame it to my problem with my 3-in-1)

PROS: You can really swap one Lipo after the other with no overheating problems!! yay!
3-in-1 does not overheat thanks to ESC's taking over that function. (my personal favorite)
Slight increase in power.

CONS: ESC's are BIG and can be a little hard to hide or to set them in a place where they don't make your heli look like a 70's prototype. (LOL)
Wires and more wires eveywhere! yuck!


WOULD I GO BACK TO BRUSHED SETUP? Nah, after all that work?

Pictures show how my BL BOL looks right now. (without skin)
I'm going to hot glue the ESC's to the main frame when i get more hot glue stix later on today.

I really enjoyed this brushless convertion bulding and flying experience.

New set of main gears arrived today along with 4 pinions that i'm just going to throw in my parts box. []

Thank you all for your opinions on gyros and mixers! very helpful!

Fernando,


PD= Peter, you will like your new bird i'm pretty sure!

UPDATED PIX: last two pictures are after the hot glue work.

sgbfly

Hi Fernando,

A quick question if I may. Is the comment above about more power in comparison to stock or xtreme motors?

I have bought the same kit. No time to fit it at the moment.

Simon

erdnuckel2

This is really NOTagainst you Peter - ITISAGAINSTXTREME!!!

It is already August 25, EVENING in Asia, and the buy it buttons are STILL the same ... remember what you wrote me about politeness and asian culture ? What about loosing face ?? If they are so unable to keep their promised dates, they should really stop promising any new ones, .... it just starts to get even more annoying! Take those parts off and bring them back once you actually got them ... no small business store owner can go and constantly advertise goods they never have ... just be honest and say "ETA totally random - we will let you know when we finally have a couple of hundred sets on the shelf. Just be ready then!"

Just my two cents, but I am slowly loosing the motivation to even try them ...

Sven

Electrotech

HI Sven and Peter,

Yesterday while browsing my country RC website i found that they are actually selling all the Big Lama upgrade! Here is the link:

[link]http://www.rcsmart.com.my/webshaper/store/viewCat.asp?catID=340[/link]

Jestine

erdnuckel2

That's nice, Jestine,

and the prices are almost identical with the ones from miracle-mart (who tries to only sell pictures of tuning parts ) but here is the thing:

The price for the Xtreme parts is 360MYR, and their net weight is probably 150g - but the store will charge it as a 2200g package. And a package this category costs about 40$ in shipping from miracle-mart to the US ... and not too long ago I was on anoter malaysian site where I checked the shipping cost on aeronuts motors (180 size) the shipping for those counting as 1300g was almost 70$ ... so most likely the shipping for 2200g will be about the same prize as the goods ... and that would not make any sense at all. Sorry but I'll have to wait ... but maybe you can get some of the stuff and tell us how it is ?? ( for example the bearing housing or the blades)
I will order all the parts one time eventually, because Iwant to be able to compare them to the quality of my German tuning parts ... but the way how miracle mart and xtreme are keeping on annoying anxiously waiting rc pilots with their procrastination tactics really makes me want to NOT get them anymore (which I will sooner or later anyway as mentioned)

Thanks for the info though,

Regards,
Sven

PS It's unfortunate that it seems to be impossible to calculate shipping cost if you don't register for the site ... I really didn't feel like going through this just to get a shipping cost calculation

RC_Addiction

Hey Simon,

Well i have to say that I under estimated the BL motors power.
They will give you more power compared to the stock and xtreme motors!
After a few more fly tests i proved me wrong on my "slightly more power" statement so yes,
the bird will be noticeable more powerful.


Hey Sven,

Yes i agree with you about all this BS on the xtreme blades release.

On the other hand, i'm trying to understand why. They will simply serve the local Asian and European customers first before
the western ones (us) Meaning us as you, me and all the peeps who live on the american continent. I guess this is normal but yeah
all those false promises full of bulls**t are not fair. I guess they just don't want to lose the customers who email them questions about their products
and they just keep giving false release dates.

This helicopter like all other is a money pit, after this last Brushless upgrade, the only mayor thing i will do to it will be those xtreme blades. After that i'm done spending money on it.

ADDED! see? here's another site from the UK this time , click [link=http://www.discount-rc-toys.com/userimages/procart93.htm]HERE[/link]
I tried to buy them from there and i got an error message after clicking on the "ship to country" button. Bulls**T!!!!!!! hahahahahaa!!!!!

fernando,

pgroom_68

Hey again Guys - well, maybe I've stuffed up!

I will copy and paste the reply here so you can be the judge:

"RE: Message from miracle-mart
Saturday, 22 August, 2009 6:04 PM
From:"miracle-mart" <[email protected]>
Add sender to Contacts - nil
To: "Peter "

Hi Peter

Will be released on coming Monday.

Thanks

kim"

...Well, did I misjudge the date and it will be coming Monday (31 August)???

Peter
P.S. Just a thought - their "summer-sale" discounts end in August - so I will have no discounts in September
P.P.S. Miracle-mart manufacture Extreme Productions parts so how can anyone else have these upgrades earlier than them?

UPDATE: I just checked my inbox and their was ANOTHER message from miracle-mart:

"Hi Peter

Big lama xtreme parts expected arrive this weekend.
And should be available for retail order next Monday.

Thank you

kim"

...so from that you may get any one of two things - either 1. Fernando is correct in assuming that they just keep the interest up by emailing responses putting it back a week each time or 2. I DID GET IT WRONG and the Monday that kim was refering to was Monday 31 August all along! I apologise if it was option2 and I've made a bad mistake! Either way it is clear that coming Monday is the day......at bl**dly last - but I will be more reserved in the future - rest assured. Until I can actually order them - I still don't believe it!![:'(]

Peter[sm=shades_smile.gif]

pgroom_68

Hey again Fernando,

Do I have to "run in" my BL motors then?

Peter[sm=shades_smile.gif]

pgroom_68

Hey again Jestine,

Did you manage to purchase some BOL Xtreme upgrades from rcsmart?

Peter[sm=49_49.gif]

rusty63

Hey Peter , Stop typing lets see new brushless Big Lama . I want to hear /see it Fly .lol...Russell

pgroom_68

Hey again Russell,

Noone more than I - but my wife is holding it for random! She says "it is to dark and [the son] has gone to bed and there will be no noise!" (a direct quote) I just say "yes, dear" and try again tomorrow! H*ll, I hope she doesn't read that![sm=red_smile.gif]

Peter[sm=shades_smile.gif]
P.S> I guess you will have to put up with my typing......[:'(]

RC_Addiction

Well you just told us who commands in the house! So please let us know how did it go when you have had the change to

pgroom_68

Hey again Fernando,

Will do!

Peter[sm=shades_smile.gif]
P.S. Do you think Russell is thinking about it seriously now?

rusty63

Im leaving my options open . Touch wood Stock motors still going . But day will come too choose . xtreme or brushless . cya

downunderdog

You shouldn't have to run in a brushless motor, afaik. You run the motor in so there isn't too much voltage/current running across the brushes before they've set/conformed to the mating rotor - so they have enough contact area and don't arc and burn the brushes. On a brushless motor, there are no brushes, so you shouldn't have to run them in.

pgroom_68

Hey thanks DUD,

I was trying to get Fernando to explain WHY he didn't get full power until a while after he had installed them. [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9043913]Here's a link to the post[/link] But it isn't important, as long as I don't encounter anything like that. I don't anticipate I will have any problems 'cause the BL set-up is preinstalled and tested according to rc711.com
I told my wife that if she doesn't give me my parcel soon, she will have to pay me the difference in the $ that I paid online in order to get it shipped fast. She is a thrifty woman - so that always works!

Peter[sm=49_49.gif]

Electrotech

Hi Peter,

I did not buy from them because i have some other parts that i need to buy from miracle mart. Thinking of once they have launch the BL products i will order it at one go!

Jestine

Buz

Well, more problems with every flight since I installed the extended shaft and the metal rotor head. First, the flybar cap came off and flung the flybar. So, I borrowed another flybar cap from another kit, installed it and put plenty of thread lock in it. So, that worked great. I took it outside last night.... took off, and was holding a hands off hover. FINALLY! About 60 seconds later, the top rotor grip assembly flew apart and it went down like a rock.
One of the bolts came out, so here I go stealing more parts from the other kit. Is anyone else having trouble keeping the extension kit together? Yes, everything was tight and I used thread lock on all of it. If this keeps happening, I'm going back to Jestine's stock rotor head assembly. I don't want to get hit by any of this cheap junk flying apart.

Buzz

erdnuckel2

Sorry to hear that Buzz, as it does really not speak too loud FOR the quality of the material in this kit ...

... BUT (listen to this, Peter ) I just was on the www.miracle-mart.com website ... and guess what???


THEYFINALLYHAVETHEBLADESREADYTOORDER!!!!

And even if they really annoyed the living daylights out of me over the last month an a half - I couldn't resist and bought two pair (so be quick, who knows how many more they actually have )
So in about a week I might be finally able to touch a REAL Xtreme blade for the big Lama - can't hardly wait for that epiphany!

I'll be back later

Sven

RC_Addiction

HAHAHAHA! I guess that's a common feeling in many of us at this thread. Well since i'm in the quest of finding-buying a new 450 size Brushless motor for my plane that i burned yesterday, i only ordered a pair of these xtreme blades.

I counted my blades yesterday and i have 5 pairs of still flyable blades in my parts box, since i don't crash that often anymore i don't know what to do with them!!

Peter don't get caught offguard and buy your xtremes!

Pix show the motor that prevented me from buying more xtreme blades and the comparison to the BOL's BL motors. THIS RC Addiction is killing me!!!!!!!!