Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

I flew my ASP 61 for one year without changing the plug... It has now eaten two new plugs and three older plugs and only flown once...... What is wrong? What plug should I be using... ??? It seems everyday that I continue to learn more about R/C flying... I have been in the sport for 14 months.. I do not know the type or brand that I used new that burned out....Careless I guess... containers gone and were not the same.... Thanks.. Richard

w8ye

My Feedback: (16)

Some of the bargain priced plugs are that way.

If you had a name brand plug, then some of the causes are running the engine too lean in mixture and contaminants in side the engine like rust for example.

Enjoy

Jim

downunder

Are you starting to get black oil in the exhaust? One thing that kills plugs is aluminium particles getting on the coil so if the oil is black I'd look very carefully inside the engine to see if something's suddenly wearing out.

Sport_Pilot

Then again even good name brands have bad batch's, I blew two OS F's once and the third one worked like a charm. Don't know if its rough handleing during shipping or just manufacturing errors. If the plug is a good one the causes are usually the engine running too lean, or the nitro is to high for the heat range of the plug. Tuned pipes can also ruin plugs, but I assume this is not the case. If you have changed fuel without retuning the engine that could be the cause.

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

What plug is recommended for the ASP .61? another question/point is that since the crash I can not get the engine to run RICH or rick enough to do the pinch test with results other than the engine quits...

Sport_Pilot

Did you replace the muffler? Some Asps need a little extra muffler back pressure to pump the fuel to the carb.

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Richard:

A quote from Dieter the Designer; "Aye seenk ve haff ze answer!"

(Emphasis mine)

Combining "Crash" and "...can not get the engine to run RICH..." you probably have a big air leak.

I did not have this problem with a Magnum I stacked in, I checked it carefully before putting it back in service and found large cracks in the carb mounting stub. You probably have one or two also. See picture attached. It's a K&B but the Magnum is similar.

The cure is simple. Pull the carb out, (you've already done this to check) clean the inside of the mounting stub and the outside of the carb mounting spigot. If you have the version with two mounting screws clean them also. If yours has the pinch bolt leave it alone. Put a bead of RTV all the way around the carb spigot, don't worry about using too much, the excess will wipe off. Put the carb back in, twisting it slightly to spread the RYV. Put a little RTV on the threads of the mounting screws and put them back in. Wipe the excess RTV off, and let it set up.

Much less probable, but you could have cracked the case around one of the mounting lugs. If you find that a new case isn't too expensive, but you can patch it with JB weld or something of that sort.

Most likely the carb sealing will cure your problem

Bill.

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

I have check the engine and the carburator and can find no cracks... I am planning to install an enya carb that was used in a test on this engine once... it ran fine... the carb is out and cleaned and inspected... Question again... will running an engine lean eat up a glow plug in under three minutes?

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Richard:

Being unable to richen the engine to a "Four stroke" condition says something is wrong. Whatever is causing it needs to be corrected, and I thought I had it.

And blowing a glow plug in a time as short as three minutes probably isn't what you are doing. Most likely the element is broken in the first few seconds but you don't know it until you try to restart. I've eaten them in an engine run as short as 45 seconds.

Bill.

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

Thanks Bill for the info... I will try the enya today and put fuel tubing on the needle valve of the asp... thanks.. Richard

bdtsr

My Feedback: (5)

ASP needle valves have big time air leak problems, I know I have 2 ASP 61s (for about 8 years) and a 120. Get some new "O" rings for the needle and put them on. Then put a nice size peice of fule tubing over the needle and clicker. This should take care of your problem.

Sport_Pilot

Though I'm sure it happens I have never had the need of this, and I own Fox and ASP engines. In fact I bought a used Fox and took the fuel tubing off and it ran fine. I have even had some that were obviously leaking (fuel leaking around the needle) and have not had any problems with the needle, and with the tank underpositive pressure I don't see the need, unless having trouble getting the idle rich enough.

The point is I don't think that enough air can leak past the needle, and at full throttle fuel would leak out, not in.

bdtsr

My Feedback: (5)

I have had eratic engine running due to worn o-rings in this area. My ASPs like the higher rpm range and seem to wear out these little o-rings. I usually put some tubing over the needle anyway to prevent it from moving. Those spring steel keepers tend to lose some tension over time.

Sport_Pilot

So much that its a PITA to adjust, those retainer's are cheap and easy to replace. Leaking needles only affect the idle if you are using muffler pressure.

bdtsr

My Feedback: (5)

Well it's not a PITA for me. I find it a simple and effective way to not have the needle move in the first place. Also, a leaking needle will put fuel all over the plane and at $15 and more for fuel, I'll keep it where it needs to be. Liquids like anything else will take the path of least resistance. If the fuel is going out the needle and not into the carb, well you get a lean running engine.

Sport_Pilot

O rings are cheap also.

I am a bit biased because I cut my finger bad once when adjusting someone else's plane with tubing wrapped on it. It was very hard to turn and I wasn't aware, my finger sliped off and the prop caught my pinky. I decided then I wouldn't do that trick unless I was absolutely sure it was leaking air. Found out that this almost never happens.

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

Thanks to everyone for the answers and info on the needle valve.... The engine is running lean for some reason and I will try any solution to correct... thanks.. Question: Will a lean engine burn out the glow plug in less that a minute of wide open running? Will a pitts style muiffler with 1 1/2 inch stacks and a broken loose stack cause a condition that could burn out glow plugs.... I shortened the stacks before all of this happen but after the crash that loosened stacks... Has the back pressure been changed to cause a lean run or is this out of the picture...?

Sport_Pilot

If lean enough it will ruin the plug instantly.

This could reduce muffler pressure which would cause it to run lean. Why not try to plug the loose stack and see if that helps? Most pitts mufflers have way too much outlet area for engines with oversized carbs.

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Richard:

It's not uncommon to have a lean problem with a Pitts type muffler just because of the free flow, and the lower pressure in the tank. Just for a trial, plug one of the stacks and see if you can then go full rich, shortening the stacks will lower the restriction, possibly you were on the edge with them at full length.

Bill.

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

Hello Bill and Sport_Pilot.... Thanks for the info on the pitts style muffler stack lengths... I will try your suggestions and I have two plastic extensions that I can slide on also to check if that helps... Will let you know monday.... Richard

Richard39

My Feedback: (14)

I changed the carburator to an Enya carb and the engine started running better... I extended the stacks one inch and increased the oil content in the fuel... everything works fine now, running a little slower and no burned out plugs... I believe the problem is the ASP carburator...must be leaking bad since the accident.... will try later to work on possible leaks and reinstall but not now...

AMB

Sorry guys cannot resist this all my 2 strokes norvel 061 thru an ST90 are now diesels glow plugs???? martin
whoops wrong irvine mark lll 39 no head available yet in a model tech magic tuned pipe pretty nice 11x6 zinger

PhilTM

This holds true for my .61 ABC. I could never get it to idle correctly, could not even kill the engine with the throttle barrel completely closed either. In the air, she'd run ok at high power settings, but if I brought her down to to idle, she'd then start loading up and either quit completely, or quit when I tried to advance the throttle.
Other (more-experienced) modelers worked with me to figure out the problem, but even they were scratching their heads. I finally got it to run right by silicone-sealing a few spots on the carb. One of the main culprits is where the carb attaches to the engine. It's not just the o-ring area there, but the locking pin under it that leaks.
First I used pieces of tubing around the high and lowspeed needles to help seal off that area. It also helps keep the needle valves from turning on their own due to vibration, which was a problem with my engine from the start. A badly designed clicker/holder is responsible for this.
Next, I carefully siliconed the o-ring at the carb mount, the flange on the carb, and the locking pin. I pressed the carb into place and clamped it there with moderat pressure, snugged the locking pin, and applied some silicone to the outside of the pin and the nut side as well.
After all of this, the engine responded properly. I could get the idle where I wanted it, I could kill it by closing the throttle barrel, and it held during flights. No more loading up and dying in the air.
If your glow plug problem is due to a leaning mixture, some of this might help.

Phil

YZY

Whats that??? I got a idle problem with my asp 53 too :{ leaks all over too

Whats a clicker??

Thanks ZY

YZY

Oh btw which would be a better choice of silicon

http://www.home-fix.com/storefront/P...ProductId=1696

Or

http://www.home-fix.com/storefront/P...ProductId=1694