re2smpc

Of course! Why didn't I think of that. Thanks!

re2smpc

Here are the latest pictures of the RichModel Long-EZ 46, glow to electric conversion. I added a brace for the Jeti 70Amp speed controller. I have also included a CAD drawing of the duct unit I will install under the speed controller. I plan to make an opening in the "belly" of the plane to accept the cooling "scoop".

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

The only warning I have is that "captured" air will put significant more air pressure inside the cabin...and a weak
attached hatch/canopy will usually eject with force. I have had it happened on my 2 30% yaks..as the opening in the
YAK 54 is huge hole and the air getting to the inside of the fuselage just is too much for the hatch. One hatch blew off, hit the elevator which naturally, downed the yak..Aerobatic Models sold me a replacement plane at cost. (sweet)

so..now, I have little air vents along side of hatch and in back..that lets that air move on thru and out..thus lowering the pressure..
something you will have to CAD up also..(nice)..

bobz

p.s. I thinking..what about an semi enclosed area that the air enters, flows over the esc..then out the same type of
duct you have designed only backwards?

re2smpc

Hi bobz. Thanks for your comments and concern. I thought about the air flow. I did a calculation on the area of the intake. I plan to drill holes in the rear "firewall" that will make the intake to exhaust flow of air 2:1. I expect that since the area for intake air will be 1/2 half the space that allows the air to escape (through the back over the electric motor) the captured aire issue wil not be an issue. What do you think?

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

yep..your on the right track...my friend just burned his esc up and it actually caught fire (hobby-lobby 300) enough to melt some the surrounding monokote. Over powering the esc with a much bigger motor, wrong prop or incorrect battery leads quickly to disaster sometimes. I have run my 46bl with 12x8e prop 4400lipo and my esc just get barely warm..so I think I will be ok.

bobz

Rube Goldberg

Just a thought....a simple and very effective "air scoop" could be easily made from the plastic packaging of nearly any of the popular brands of spinners. The one package would yield a pair of "scoops", one for the intake and one for the exhaust---though I do agree on the exhaust area being at least twice the intake area. Drilling to "vent" the firewall sounds like a good idea. Sounds like you guys are real close to having an electric version in the air!

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

Yep, but I think Steve is putting more engineering into it than the original designers. This would be the most awesome plane if it could have retracts, rudders, and a nice canopy attachment..they just did not go full tilt with this model.

bobz

I maiden my patty wagstaff tomorrow..with new g-62. I hope I don't blow the wings off!

re2smpc

Thanks bobz for the compliment. You are right, being an engineer, I can never build a plane and keep it "stock". I always have to add my own touches to it. This Long-EZ glow to conversion is turning out to be my best yet. I've made some progress on the project and wanted to post some new images. You can see the finished air duct in place (outside and inside views) and the firewall with 4 additional 1" diameter holes to allow the air to escape from the cabin. Blind nuts are also installed to except the brushless motor mount. The other images show the finished main wing. I cut checkerboard Ultracote to match the existing trim lines and placed on the underside of the wing to help with orientation. I must admit, I am very pleased with the results so far. I am going to pass on adding the rudder control and front retract for now. (I may decide to add at a later time.) My next part of the project is to work on that slick canopy attachment method. I'll take some of Rube's suggestions and add my own ideas.

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

very nice! i like to ultra cote added. I been so busy with my 43%, I can't find time to work on my EZ..sorry
I show you what I mean....

re2smpc

Looks like you have a job on your hands too! Isn't it amazing that no matter how many planes you have, you always want to build more. Ain't that the truth!

re2smpc

Anyone reading this thread know where I can purchase a red, 2 1/2" plastic spinner for electric push-prop applications? (I have a standard electric prop and will run the brushless motor in reverse direction.) I have a spinner for conventional setup (that I thought I could use) but just realized today that I will have to make some modifications to it to make it work with the prop installed in reverse.

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

http://www.maxxprod.com/mpi/mpi-11.html

try here

re2smpc

bobz, I checked the site you recommended. They don't offer and plastic spinners (only aluminum). I don't think there is enough demand for this type of product for any manufacturers to offer them. I will look at the standard one I have and see how I can modify the prop openings to make it work with the prop mounted in revers orientation.

I now have another question: What method did you use to mount the canard in the fusalage? I made the openings last night and pushed the canard through into position. I don't see any other way than to remove some of the covering on the wing that is inside the cabin and apply epoxy to the internal intersection points. I also thought of just using hot glue to keep it in place (mine has a nice snug fit) in case of a bad landing so it breaks free and doen't cause too much damage.

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

yes, i hated to insert carnard like that..I still think i will break the epoxy..and make it attached differently..like a wing sadle with some bolts.
I need to redo the clevis..to that metal horn as it is so much slop..
a really bad design on the canard this plane.

bobz

re2smpc

OK I have a dilema. What is the best design for a battery tray? I need to securely hold my 4 cell, 4000mAh battery. How much "hold" is required to be safe?

bobzilla

My Feedback: (63)

Lots...and lots..as the battery is quite heavy and depending on how you fly..could rip free easy.
I started to make a beam mount (two 1/2 x 1/4") accross fuselage in front of plane and velcro in the battery, but to get the cg
right it needs to mount way up front under the top of fuselage..I am also now at that very stage of building..and on hold till I figure out my next move..I certainly don't want to ad tail weight to balance out..as wing loading is very critical here for good flight.

bobz

Rube Goldberg

As Bobz says, the hole in the horn for the canard/elevator is probably much larger than any clevis. So drill you another smaller hole in the metal horn then hook the clevis and rod to it before you slip the whole assembly into the canard mounting area--which of course you must do before you slip the canard into place.

I would definitely "spot glue" with thick CA at the 4 corners of the canard inside the fuselage top and bottom of the canard. Putting it together so it will break loose in case of a mishap is what you want. Otherwise if it is in there solid, you'll break the canard right at the fuselage....bet you can guess how I know!

Spinner mod----take your pocket knife and cut out the area for the prop. Works just as well, nobody will even notice it. Been there done that.

re2smpc

I think I have found a solution for the battery tray! From my past experience with racing RC cars, I found some Associated "Battery Cups" for the RC10 dirt buggy. (See picture). I think this will work perfectly. It is just the right size for the 4000mAh, 4 cell, lipo battery I will be using. I plan to mount these to a plywood base (the right distance apart). The 2 cross bars, with quick release clips, should provide all the strength I need to hold the heavy battery (13 oz.) in place. It will also provide plenty of open area for cooling.

re2smpc

It's been a while since I posted images of my build progress. Here you go:

For the removable canopy I made front the attachment using balsa, ply, and dowels. Back attachment is ply with rare earth magnets. The sides are held down with high strength Velco.

re2smpc

For the canard wing attachment, mine had a very snug fit in the fuse openings so I only needed to epoxy a small piece of square basswood to secure it in place.

For the motor mount, I custom made 4 aluminum tubes to position the AXI 2826/10 motor in the correct location.

In order to mount the prop in the reverse direction, I took a Dremel tool to the backplate of the spinner.

For the main power open loop circuit, I used an Eflite connector and some Deans connectors.

My next post will be images of the finished plane. I'm almost done!

Ameh

Was said (back in October)

"The little electric Long EZ 380 is a Richmodel plane. It's a fun little plane, but compared to the 46 size ones it has some nasty habits in the "stall department".......flying along at say 70% power or less if you make too tight of a turn---probably 30 degrees and higher---the little plane goes through an oscillation of intermittent stalls....in other words the front end starts bobbing up and down rapidly as the canard stalls and then once again starts flying. Not so much of a problem in normal flight, but landing that little dude is NOT easy when it starts the bobbing stuff near the ground! The yellow Long EZ 46 exhibits NONE of that nasty behavior."

I just wanted to comment on the fact that this nose bobbing is designed into the Long EZ to prevent main wing stall (deep stall) and is an example of Burt Rutan's genius. The The .46 will not bob because there is a design flaw with the model. BE CAREFUL with the .46 as if you get slow you will find yourself in a deep stall with nothing to do but add power and hope you have enough altitude to recover.

Does your .46 not show any bad stall habbits at slow speed? The .46 I have flown it makes a violent departure at slow speeds and aft stick makes one right turn and heads for terra forma.

re2smpc

Ameh,

The one I am building is the RichModel 46 size version. Does this one have te same design flaw? It hasn't been in the air yet (just completing the build) so I don't know if it will handle like you described. (I hope not.) I will definitely remember duirng the maiden flight to not make any sharp turns and I will try to keep my speed up during landing.

Steve

Ameh

Steve,

They sure look like the same plane. I think someone mentioned that earlier. The only Long EZ type RC plane that mimics the full scale version (that I know of) is the Experimental Aicraft Models Velocity XL. They went through extensive testing with airfoils and changes to canard incidence. It also has airfoiled winglets which the nitro does not (truth be told it does not need them) That plane is also ~$1000 with engine setup. NOTE: I am not affiliated with Experimental Aircraft Models in any way.

That said the Nitro plane has plenty of other great flight qualities that do represent full scale performance. Here are some tips for flying the EZ

1. The EZ will glide and glide and float and float and float down the runway. Typical approach angles will yield LONG landing runs. You need decend at a shallower angle, especially since you cannot slip the EZ (no rudders)
2. Make sure you fly the plane to the ground with minimal "flare", keep you speed up at first then slowely try slower and slower landing speeds, much like the Nitro Bobcat (another great plane) or Jet. If you catch yourself with the nose way up, go around nose high low speed is where the departure happens.
3. I have never flown another plane that tracks like the EZ. Wherever the nose is pointed, it will go with zero adverse yaw coming out of turns.
4. This plane is FAST and will pick up even more speed when you point the nose down. You should see great run times with your electric set up.
5. Roll rates are quick. If you have dual or expo, use'm

This plane is a blast to fly, just requires your attention. Let us know when you get flying!!!

Ameh

Rube Goldberg

I'll agree with Ameh's suggestions, and elaborate on #2 where he notes:

2. Make sure you fly the plane to the ground with minimal "flare", keep you speed up at first then slowely try slower and slower landing speeds, much like the Nitro Bobcat (another great plane) or Jet. If you catch yourself with the nose way up, go around nose high low speed is where the departure happens.

The problem with doing a go around after finding yourself in this condition (like any other plane) is that it might just be too late....especially with the Long-EZ that we are discussing, as it is not going to recover as quick as a conventional tractor prop plane that has air flowing over the surfaces provided by the engine.

Ground effect----this model is certainly affected by ground effect on takeoff. When it rotates and you start to climb out make it reeeeeaaalllll shallow or else when you do fly out of the ground effect it is going to take a dip on you. You may or may not have the altitude and power to recover.

Deep stall...my story!

The one flight where I did encounter "deep stall" occured while flying upwind in a 15-18MPH constant breeze at about 100' AGL. The engine flamed out and with no where to just extend straight ahead to make the landing, I made a quick left turn and once flying downwind, the plane became slower than the wind. Not good! The left wing then dropped and in it went straight down into a very small bush in a waist high brair patch thicket. I had absolutely no control. I figured it was totalled. To my most pleasant surprise, it only suffered a minor scratch on the nose cone!

In '06 I decided after 30+ years of flying RC I wanted a "real" challenge. So my fleet for the year included a 120 size Gee Bee R2, the Long-EZ 46 and finally the Rutan Quickie 40. I think I succeeded!

Re2smpc---

Thats a DANDY job you did on the canopy. Two thumbs up!

re2smpc

Thanks Rube! Yes. I am very pleased how my modifications turned out. I'll mount the main wing and check the CG this weekend. I will use the receiver NiCad pack (mounted in the nose) to make any adjustments. Can't wait to get this baby in the air!

Steve