aussiesteve

That is so incredibly valid. (Yes, I know I am guilty of that exact promotion). This is one of the beauties of us having a heavy model certification regime here in Aus. It helps to weed out a little of the ignorance.

So, having reviewed both the above, I think I will change over to Gas/Glow - no more pesky ignition systems to cause problems and nothing to connect the Optikill to


Now what do the large glow engine users use for their remote kills again?

My (semi?) final word on this issue is to do with product quality - but not the quality of the kill switches. There have been a few instances of "copied" carbs on "certain brands of" engines that do not properly shut off due to QC related issues with either the engine or the carb. These are often used by the ignorant and whenever I see one of those particular brands used, I always strongly recommend an optikill to the user (who is usually happy to buy it because it is "cutting edge technology") I do this because it will be only a matter of time before they ahve a problem.

Congrats on the new arrivals Pat, I haven't been "blessed" with grandkids yet (and having witnessed the antics of my late teenaged kids, am not sure they should breed )

Capt Cash

My Feedback: (1)

<span style="FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri","sans-serif"; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; mso-ascii-theme-font: minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family: Calibri; mso-fareast-theme-font: minor-latin; mso-hansi-theme-font: minor-latin; mso-bidi-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-bidi-theme-font: minor-bidi; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">Yesterday my throttle servo tray came apart on my 30% Sbach about 2 min into a flight. The opto kill came in handy allowing me to kill the engine at safe point for landing and not fly another nerve racking 12-15 min at near full throttle. A servo choke would have been convenient, but I see no need in hauling the extra weight unless your cowl setup just won't allow you to access a manual type choke handle. 

Another thing that crossed my mind is the throttle spring that comes on these engines.  Mine was just unhooked but not taken off.  Now if I would have left it hooked up with tension, it would have instantantly killed the engine when the throttle servo tray came looose because I had already removed the engine idle screw.  But even if I left the idle screw in, the spring would have lowered the engine to idle which may not have been much different than a dead stick.  And with next to no power at the wrong time, the landing could have been a much different outcome.

My first kill switch was the 42% Opto Kill and it gave me nothing but trouble. With a Futaba 2.4 radio it was erratic and intermittenly cut the ignition in and out on my engine at completely arbitrary times showing no pattern of what it was doing or why.  I thought I had engine trouble forever till I finally figured it out by hooking up the little red ignition light and seeing that the engine ran rough at the exact times when the light flickered intermittenly. I never did put that ignition kill in another plane so I can't be sure that it wasn't something to do with my setup or not, but I did do all the usual trouble shooting like replacing the batteries, etc. 

I now use the Smart-Fly opto kill switches and they've worked flawlessly ever since.  I'll continue to use opto kills as long as they work as advertised.</span>

ameyam

Ok, electronic optikill (EMS) as a backup. Servo (ball bearing standard servo, probably Hitec HS85MG or Futaba 3305) with ball links on the throttle. No separate choke servo though. I will setup the optikill and throttle servo to cutoff the engine in failsafe.

Is the throttle setup for gas different from glow? In glow, I adjust the carb to 50% open with servo horn at 90deg to servo body and adjust the linkage as required. Thereafter, I adjust the ATVs equally both sides

Ameyam

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Far too many people remove or disconnect the throttle return spring. Why they do this is an absolute unknown sice there is no valid reason for doing so. You learned a valuable lesson. Leave that spring intact and attached. If the idle stop screw has been removed, and it should be, that spring will act as an instant engine kill every time linkage spearates from the carb. It has acted as an engine kill for me twice in 40 years.

TimBle

TOMthe reality is that the hobby is filled with people of varying intellect, personality and attitude.
At one flying club, the members are of the "just wanna fly variety" and don;t give a hoot about safety. An incident was related to me where a flyer picked up his 2.4Ghz radio by the aerial and it broke off. So they tried to fix it at the field. they found what they thought was the aerial plug and plugged it back in. Reassembled the radio and went flying. The Flight lasted 12 seconds before he aircraft had no control.........."Should have range checked....."
there was 5 other club members around and none had the respect for their own safety to stop the pilot from flying the plane.

Same with airplane set up, I've seen some scratch built planes that should rather be used as static display at a modern art museum and some ARF's that belong in a Aviation tutorial on how to do things right.
SO back to gasoline engines. We;re always going to get folk who will set up htheir controls meticulously and others who will slap things to etter and hoep for the best. Ultimately the appetite for safety and redundancy lies with the pilot since I have not found a club where a safety officer will inspect a membersnew plane to ensure its safe to fly.

Whenever I see a new plane at the field I always shuffle over to have a look. I;'ve built up a fairly good idea of who builds well and who does not. When the shoddy builders take to the air I land and watch rather than have a plane zooming about that could lose a elevator or have radio lock out because the builder did not build or preflight it correctly.

To me, the presense of an Opto-kill just says " Ithought things through". Howeer if a bloke does not have one I'll ask him why. If he says he can kill the engine from the choke servo or closeing the throttle valve then I'm ok with that.

on_your_six

My Feedback: (11)

Just saying, be careful what you write, because old words can come back to haunt you. When giving written or even oral advice, I always err on the side of safety or the conservative. What I do might be slightly different based on prior experience. I have heard of flying fields that require a remote shutoff on ignition planes. I don't think it is a bad idea... as stated here a few posts ago "the servo came loose", of course that would never happen to you and you always check your equipment and structure completely before ever taking off.

Well, in the case mentioned... the simple failed and the "fancy" safety system worked. Granted it could go either way, but together they form a system of redundancy that worked. Two layers of redundant systems is really not a lot. Talk to Boeing or Airbus about that. How many redundant systems are required for space flight? Sure those are manned aircraft, but a runaway RC aircraft can be of some danger to life too!

So, plan it, use appropriate material, install it correctly, test it correctly, fly it correctly and use redundant systems where possible. Multiple servos on a control surface, Ailerons on separate channels, split elevators on separate channels, dual battery systems, dual radios and systems, and multiple engines, WHERE APPROPRIATE. Fancy???? I think not. I could care less if my crash is more expensive... I care a lot more when I hurt someone when it could have been prevented.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

My reply that you quoted was written as a response to the original attorney comment. If ebveryone went through life in a manner intended to prevent an attorney from gaining ammunition, nobody would do anything. They certainly would not drive, ride a horse, fly a plane, buy a home, participate in a sport that involved other people, let their kids go to school, participate in gainful employment or much anything else.

People can sue for anything and nothing. All they need to do is have some imaginary claim on the paperwork to get the ball rolling. From there it's all defense. Being one that has been a defendant in a model airplane suit I understand this all too well. FYI, the plaintiff lost.

On another subject, our daughter blessed us with two new grand children last night

pilotpete2

Congratulations[8D]
Pete

jedijody

My Feedback: (1)

Congrats Old Man!

I take it everyone is doing well, prayers work wonders!

Desertlakesflying

My Feedback: (28)

I only use the opto kill with my Smart-Fly.....no other switch except the dual Miracle switch in the cockpit for the radio power

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Overall yes and thank you and everyone.

fishkillbill

My Feedback: (4)

I was using a 42% Products Opto Kill switch on a motor with an electronic ignition and it worked great. I just switch to a Zenoah motor that doesn't have electronic ignition. Can I still use the Opto switch?

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Good question. If using a magneto you'll have to find a way to interrupt the hot circuit. Don't know if an optical kill could be adapted since the design is dependant on a separate battery power supply.

You might just have to learn how to set things up the old fashioned way, using a servo to trigger a swicth that interrupts the ground circuit. From there learn about the correct ways to install throttle linkage and using the radio failsafes. Of course you could spend a lot of money to convert to an EI just to use an optical kill. Silly, but there seems to be a lot of people in this forum that would rather do that instead of setting up right to begin with.

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXJ776&P=ML

fishkillbill

My Feedback: (4)

Thanks for the info. It does look rather crude. How does a servo activate the microswitch? I used the "retracts" switch before, hoe would that work now? Bill

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Well stated, and a good attitude!!!

Whether we use a nechanical means (throttle kill -or- choke kill), or
an electronic means of killing the gas eng (ign kill) is simply a fliers
personal choice to choose one or several such methods. Each has it's
faults & benefits. Don't let a small group attempt to downgrade you for chosing
other than they're personal choice.

Having some means of remotely killing your engine is what's important,
not which way is best.

Whichever is chosen, do TEST that it works as it should BEFORE you actually need it!
In that line of thought comes the issue of F/S. Test that you setup the F/S properly,
and that your F/S actually works correctly {IF your Tx/rcv allows F/S}!

Some tx's only allow F/S on certain channels, ie-throttle, others allow F/S on
all proportional channels. Read up on what your tx can do.

Clean

I don't know how other 2.4 systems work, but my FrSky receiver is programmable for FS.  put the controls where you want them to be in FS mode, hit the button and that's where it will go.  Played with that a bit the other day in preparation for when my optikill gets here.  All channels are programmable that way, so check your receivers instructions as well.

nonstoprc

My Feedback: (90)

I have been using the choke servo approach and assign the the switch on right top of the radio as the kill switch. With a relatively fast choke servo, I can have the kill in less than 1 second.

montagma

My Feedback: (3)

This should lead to an interesting discussion...<div>
</div><div>I just purchased the TF P-40 60 size ARF and will be using the DLE 20cc.  Here is what I know so far...</div><div>
</div><div>1.  I will use a rod for a manual choke lever, no servo</div><div>2.  I am going to use an optical kill or an IBE</div><div>
</div><div>Here is the question...</div><div>
</div><div>If I am using a Futaba 2.4 8 channel receiver, could I use an IBE with a LiFe battery to run both the ignition and receiver?  Am I better off having 2 LiFe batteries and running one to the receiver and the other off of an optical kill switch to power the ignition?  I have a Syssa 30cc in a seagull yak and I have been running the Sysssa IBE with a single battery (5 Cell NiMh 4200mAh) for both the receiver and ignition...no issues to report, although the LiFe battery could save some weight!</div><div>
</div><div>
</div>

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

It can be done. The question: Is your plane valued at only the cost of one battery? I always like to run that one by when I'm setting up a plane.

TheRickster

My Feedback: (12)

I find when someone wants to run the IBEC I throw them this scenario.. "Would you have enough faith in the IBEC to run the flight pack off the Ignition. battery??" Normally they say, uh NO... Point made....

Rick