WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
05-07-2002, 05:09 AM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
RC Jones and all,
To put the Saito 300 in, I needed to disassemble the firewall box and move the firewall back an inch. It came apart with ease...not a good thing. I replaced the firewall with two quality 1/4 ply ones epoxied together. I also mounted the throttle servo inside the fuse.
Balancewise, I put everything up as forward as I could and ended up a little nose heavy. One of the batteries now sits just forward of the cockpit floor, and everything else is forward of that.
I've had some ARF's before and was always leery of them vibrating themselves to death, so I spent the money for the twin. It is nice and smooth, and BTW, it will Takeoff and fly on one cylinder, ask me how I know. Won't do it on too hot of a day or at high altitude. There was just a little margin for error, but not much.
See ya....
Chris.
To put the Saito 300 in, I needed to disassemble the firewall box and move the firewall back an inch. It came apart with ease...not a good thing. I replaced the firewall with two quality 1/4 ply ones epoxied together. I also mounted the throttle servo inside the fuse.
Balancewise, I put everything up as forward as I could and ended up a little nose heavy. One of the batteries now sits just forward of the cockpit floor, and everything else is forward of that.
I've had some ARF's before and was always leery of them vibrating themselves to death, so I spent the money for the twin. It is nice and smooth, and BTW, it will Takeoff and fly on one cylinder, ask me how I know. Won't do it on too hot of a day or at high altitude. There was just a little margin for error, but not much.
See ya....
Chris.
05-07-2002, 01:37 PM
#28
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Jerry, I read the review on the trainer and I can tell you right now without even removing it from the box there is no comparison. There must have been a different co. contracted to build these new ones. Bill
05-07-2002, 02:34 PM
#29
Good Point!
Taildragger,
That is one fact we (the consumers) never know - and I'm sure there are more than one company doing the same model for a variety of 'manufacturers'....sort of leaves us in the dark in a way.
Did you get a chance to see the actual model of the JI-310? I'm sure the importer (Pacific) required better manual(s) on the Tiger Moth and Gee Bee - what do you think?
Jerry
That is one fact we (the consumers) never know - and I'm sure there are more than one company doing the same model for a variety of 'manufacturers'....sort of leaves us in the dark in a way.
Did you get a chance to see the actual model of the JI-310? I'm sure the importer (Pacific) required better manual(s) on the Tiger Moth and Gee Bee - what do you think?
Jerry
05-07-2002, 03:41 PM
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Re: GP Pitts has Problems!
Loopman,
Unforutnately, the "kit coments" forum is meant only for marketing. It will take some time fo rhtose concerns to get to the right departments to assist you.
However, in the mean time, that's what i'm here for! :-)
First, let me tell you that numerous production models HAVE been tested and were tested extensively.
That said, i very much want to get your pitts back so we can get a good, first hand look at her and at the problems you're seeing. Despite extensive QC, problems can and will continue to slip through. It is veyr important to us that we resolve those concerns.
Please email a member of my staff, [email protected], with a copy of this email. She will send you a US mail call tag to box up your pitts and return it to my attention. If it arrives during my absence later this month, she will get it delivered directly to the head of R&D who will be waiting for it.
We take our models, our QC, and our support VERY, VERY seriously. And I'm looking forward to the chance to get to the bottom of your concerns with this model and make it right.
Sincerely,
Mrs. AnnMarie Cross
Senior Manager, Proprietary Service and Support
Great Planes Model Distributors
[email protected]
www.greatplanes.com
www.bestrc.com
Unforutnately, the "kit coments" forum is meant only for marketing. It will take some time fo rhtose concerns to get to the right departments to assist you.
However, in the mean time, that's what i'm here for! :-)
First, let me tell you that numerous production models HAVE been tested and were tested extensively.
That said, i very much want to get your pitts back so we can get a good, first hand look at her and at the problems you're seeing. Despite extensive QC, problems can and will continue to slip through. It is veyr important to us that we resolve those concerns.
Please email a member of my staff, [email protected], with a copy of this email. She will send you a US mail call tag to box up your pitts and return it to my attention. If it arrives during my absence later this month, she will get it delivered directly to the head of R&D who will be waiting for it.
We take our models, our QC, and our support VERY, VERY seriously. And I'm looking forward to the chance to get to the bottom of your concerns with this model and make it right.
Sincerely,
Mrs. AnnMarie Cross
Senior Manager, Proprietary Service and Support
Great Planes Model Distributors
[email protected]
www.greatplanes.com
www.bestrc.com
Originally posted by Loopman
I am not going to severely knock GP as they have some very good stuff out there. I will say that the GP Pitts that I purchased will never leave the ground! I bought mine from a very reputable hobby shop. I opened the box upon arrival and inspected all parts for "shipping" damage with none found I proceeded with construction. I have built GP ARF's in the past and followed the booklet and the included addendum to the letter. Once I got the top wing done and started to mount it I noticed rather quickly that the hardwood plates that the metal brackets screw into were way too soft and the holes for the cabane struts were way off on their original locations.
I contacted GP and after explaining this to the tech, who by the way was very polite, I was promised and received a replacement wing. I thought my problem was solved but upon inspection I found cracked ribs in the right wing section. The hardwood plates were of better quality however but stiil not of the quality that you find at your LHS wood bin.
After reading the posts on this thread I inspected the fuse and lo and behold found cracks in the wood structure and a couple of wood joints with poor quality fit and joining. I am to say the least disappointed that such a fine looking aircraft underwent extremely poor quality QA before being shipped.
I am sure that the guys and gals at GP tested the prototype to the extreme, problem may be that they should have tested one of the production run ones as well. Prototypes tend to meet and or exceed most everyone's expectations.
Also, an ARF is not meant to be a kit that you have to rebuild to assure success and longevity. If I had the time I would build all of my kits from scratch or from a regular kit, but I don't. I rely on reputable companies such as GP to do that.
I have used GP's aircraft kit review forum at their website. I will wait to hear from them. I wish all of you who have a flying GP Pitts continued success.
Happy Flying!
LOOPMAN
I am not going to severely knock GP as they have some very good stuff out there. I will say that the GP Pitts that I purchased will never leave the ground! I bought mine from a very reputable hobby shop. I opened the box upon arrival and inspected all parts for "shipping" damage with none found I proceeded with construction. I have built GP ARF's in the past and followed the booklet and the included addendum to the letter. Once I got the top wing done and started to mount it I noticed rather quickly that the hardwood plates that the metal brackets screw into were way too soft and the holes for the cabane struts were way off on their original locations.
I contacted GP and after explaining this to the tech, who by the way was very polite, I was promised and received a replacement wing. I thought my problem was solved but upon inspection I found cracked ribs in the right wing section. The hardwood plates were of better quality however but stiil not of the quality that you find at your LHS wood bin.
After reading the posts on this thread I inspected the fuse and lo and behold found cracks in the wood structure and a couple of wood joints with poor quality fit and joining. I am to say the least disappointed that such a fine looking aircraft underwent extremely poor quality QA before being shipped.
I am sure that the guys and gals at GP tested the prototype to the extreme, problem may be that they should have tested one of the production run ones as well. Prototypes tend to meet and or exceed most everyone's expectations.
Also, an ARF is not meant to be a kit that you have to rebuild to assure success and longevity. If I had the time I would build all of my kits from scratch or from a regular kit, but I don't. I rely on reputable companies such as GP to do that.
I have used GP's aircraft kit review forum at their website. I will wait to hear from them. I wish all of you who have a flying GP Pitts continued success.
Happy Flying!
LOOPMAN
05-07-2002, 04:32 PM
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Shipping query on Pitts?
Ann Marie,
Thank you, I will definitely send this plane back to you if you can tell me how. Since the upper and lower wings are joined and the fuse has the vertical & horizontal stabs installed, and the firewall has been adapted for the install of my gas engine, it will not fit back into its original container. The only way to get it back is to surgically remove what has been installed with a razor saw and x-acto knife!
Thanks
LOOPMAN
Thank you, I will definitely send this plane back to you if you can tell me how. Since the upper and lower wings are joined and the fuse has the vertical & horizontal stabs installed, and the firewall has been adapted for the install of my gas engine, it will not fit back into its original container. The only way to get it back is to surgically remove what has been installed with a razor saw and x-acto knife!
Thanks
LOOPMAN
05-07-2002, 10:40 PM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Tailskid, No I didn't actually see one of the trainer kits. I glanced through the manual and it seems to be adequate for the level of expertise this model is meant for. It may not be up to par for a rank beginner. The hardware in the Moth kit is the best I've seen in any kit ARF or Ubuild it. There was not one wrinkle in the covering that I could find Firewall is allready fuelproofed w/epoxy resin and the control cables for the tail surfaces already installed. The cockpits have removable hatches to access the radio gear. The hinge work is already done for you. The landing gear seems to be some sort of Stainless steel wire that is welded together and is very stout. I really wish I had time to spend on it right now but it's going to have to wait. Another problem I have is storage. I ain't got no place to put it if I put it together. (I know, double negatives, ain't I a bad boy!).
05-08-2002, 11:12 AM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Loop,
We'll need you to cut her down to get her back in her original box. Please be sure to leave any problem areas (ie wing center section) in tact.
We'll need you to cut her down to get her back in her original box. Please be sure to leave any problem areas (ie wing center section) in tact.
05-08-2002, 02:43 PM
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Re: INTERESTED!
Originally posted by RORO
INTERESTED in outcome and fix of the bird, as I am trying to finish mine up now. Will look at some mods and get back and compare mods of others.
INTERESTED in outcome and fix of the bird, as I am trying to finish mine up now. Will look at some mods and get back and compare mods of others.
05-09-2002, 12:28 AM
#37
GP Pitts Outcome/Upgrade
Yes, by all means. I am currently on assignment away from home and cannot build my Great Planes Pitts right now. I suppose that puts me in a good position for now. If there are improvements or new and updated or replacement wings, I will be waiting patiently for the final outcome. I plan on using the same Quadra 50 I used in my Byron Pitts. It should be the same plane except for weight. Mine was 17.5 lbs and flew great. Please keep me informed. Thank you...Jon Wilson [email protected]
05-10-2002, 01:50 AM
#38
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
I would also like to know the outcome--however--(no disrespect to AnnMarie or GP) the small wood blocks may be ok and fly great and last for a long time. I am certainly no structural engineer, however, I would not attempt to fly this beautiful plane until I am certain the cabanes and top wing are attached to something very solid in the fuse. After seeing the size of the blocks, and the size of the plane---(this is no 40 size trainer)---I do this because of my own peace of mind-just a personal thing, I suppose.
05-10-2002, 02:48 AM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
I am just finishing up mine right now, up to mounting the engine (the new Fuji 50). I would like to thank all of the posters in this forum, and Ann Marie. I needed some advice on wing incidence, and immediately found it doing a search. My numbers are the same as most others. I was concerned about the wing attachment points, and cut away in the area of a couple of the attachment point little marking holes. In my lower wing, there were not “square blocks”, but a hardwood rail that supports the #4 screw under the sheeting. I could see how perhaps in the factory, if the point was marked just a bit off, or the rail is off a tad, you would be screwing into the sheeting, and after hardening the hole with c/a per the instructions, it might appear you are in solid wood. I very carefully ensured I was in solid wood for all the mounting points. As confirmation of this theory, when I installed the main landing gear, and carefully marked off the six holes, two of them failed to meet up with the hardwood rails underneath, being off just a bit. I moved the landing gear around, about 1/8 of an inch and everything is now in solid wood. Please be careful when locating the holes and double check you are going into solid wood.
I also replaced the tailwheel set up with an Ohio Superstar piece, much better. I have the GP suggested set up in my ¼ scale Giles, and it is not acceptable for grass. Acts like a tailskid rather than a tailwheel.
A careful preflight when assembling for the first time of the day, and then check it over real good after each flight should catch anything before it happens. This is a big airplane, and a wonderful piece. Flown appropriately, it should last a long time.
I also replaced the tailwheel set up with an Ohio Superstar piece, much better. I have the GP suggested set up in my ¼ scale Giles, and it is not acceptable for grass. Acts like a tailskid rather than a tailwheel.
A careful preflight when assembling for the first time of the day, and then check it over real good after each flight should catch anything before it happens. This is a big airplane, and a wonderful piece. Flown appropriately, it should last a long time.
05-10-2002, 03:09 AM
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Great Planes
You just have to take your hats off to GP/amcross for even being in on these gripe sessions and having the backbone to respond and attempt to resolve ASAP. I have looked and don't see very many other dist. doing the same. GP/amcross is right here in among us getting the lowdown on the stuff they sell and is willing to help right there on the spot. I like that about GP...I don't know about the rest of you ARFERS but that makes me feel better know such a high up rep is right at our finger tips. I gave own a bunch of GP stuff and will damn sure by more....and no...my GP Giles 202 was not perfect right out of the box....I did not expect it to be.
Http//:www.waynelyn.com
Http//:www.waynelyn.com
05-10-2002, 05:21 PM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Thanks for the kind words, guys...patience for me, please, over the next few days, as the gent's damaged wing has just arrived....the R&D boys were like a pack of wolves on a feeding frenzy when it was delivered to them!
They take this type of issue VERY, VERY seriously. I have no doubt that i'll have extensive feedback early next week.
They take this type of issue VERY, VERY seriously. I have no doubt that i'll have extensive feedback early next week.
05-14-2002, 08:21 AM
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AnnMarie..Ref. GP Pitts
AnnMarie:
Am still interested in the pitts,regardless of the problems with the upper wing attachment..........Just like to have the necessary corrections and adjustments (Holddown blocks,etc) for the problems that were mention here.....thanx for your input in regards to this aircraft....
Am still interested in the pitts,regardless of the problems with the upper wing attachment..........Just like to have the necessary corrections and adjustments (Holddown blocks,etc) for the problems that were mention here.....thanx for your input in regards to this aircraft....
05-14-2002, 05:55 PM
#43
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Friends,
First, thank you all for your input and your patience. The extended amount of information received from this group was instrumental in helping us pinpoint the problem, get an idea of the scope of concern, and direct our resources into resolving the issue at hand.
When we first received word of a failed upper wing mount, we inspected the aircraft our teams were already flying and found no problems. When this thread began, telling us that more problems might exist, we pulled several kits from stock and inspected those as well, no problems found.
When we received the first modeler's failed wing, we were able to determine the exact problem and knew what to look for. As I stated in my most recent post, the R&D boys were like a pack of wolves tackling that aircraft! Immediately afterward, they inspected a large quantity of other Pitts upper wings to determine how many others had the same problem.
As a result of the diligence (and despite a bit of abuse! grin) of this group in gathering and sharing information, we were able to identify the problem, and the scope thereof, much more rapidly than through our normal channels. So, this time, its' my turn to thank this great group for their insight and information!
Below please find a link for all Pitts owners regarding checking their aircraft for a possible failure point. Please share this link/worksheet with all of your club members and fellow modelers you know.
http://www.greatplanes.com/techsuppo...a1218tech.html
Again, my sincerest thanks to all of you for the extensive support and for the patience. Our apologies for any difficulties/inconvenience, and I'm glad we were able to reach a resolution so rapidly.
Sincerely,
Mrs. AnnMarie Cross
Senior Manager, Proprietary Services and Support
Great Planes Model Distributors
[email protected]
www.greatplanes.com
www.bestrc.com
NO AUTORESPONDER
First, thank you all for your input and your patience. The extended amount of information received from this group was instrumental in helping us pinpoint the problem, get an idea of the scope of concern, and direct our resources into resolving the issue at hand.
When we first received word of a failed upper wing mount, we inspected the aircraft our teams were already flying and found no problems. When this thread began, telling us that more problems might exist, we pulled several kits from stock and inspected those as well, no problems found.
When we received the first modeler's failed wing, we were able to determine the exact problem and knew what to look for. As I stated in my most recent post, the R&D boys were like a pack of wolves tackling that aircraft! Immediately afterward, they inspected a large quantity of other Pitts upper wings to determine how many others had the same problem.
As a result of the diligence (and despite a bit of abuse! grin) of this group in gathering and sharing information, we were able to identify the problem, and the scope thereof, much more rapidly than through our normal channels. So, this time, its' my turn to thank this great group for their insight and information!
Below please find a link for all Pitts owners regarding checking their aircraft for a possible failure point. Please share this link/worksheet with all of your club members and fellow modelers you know.
http://www.greatplanes.com/techsuppo...a1218tech.html
Again, my sincerest thanks to all of you for the extensive support and for the patience. Our apologies for any difficulties/inconvenience, and I'm glad we were able to reach a resolution so rapidly.
Sincerely,
Mrs. AnnMarie Cross
Senior Manager, Proprietary Services and Support
Great Planes Model Distributors
[email protected]
www.greatplanes.com
www.bestrc.com
NO AUTORESPONDER
05-14-2002, 09:34 PM
#44
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GP - Other Manf's Observe and LEARN!!
Ann Marie, et al at Great Planes; As one of the first apparent fliers of this Pitts, I have to say that you guys (gals) have stepped up BIG time being proactive about not only OWNING the problem, but offering an easily-doable solution in the field! There are purists, who might object saying that it should be "perfect" from GP, but I'd challenge them to THEIR last "perfect" work. Mistakes will be made, and I am sorry for those who lost airplane(s).
BUT - GP has obviously owned the mess, and the solution, and I'm off to the shop. BTW - my forward cabane is slightly off-center, no cracking, but I'm reinforcing anyway, because I have the ZDZ 40 on board. Rear cabane was perfectly centered.
Ya'll done good!!!
BUT - GP has obviously owned the mess, and the solution, and I'm off to the shop. BTW - my forward cabane is slightly off-center, no cracking, but I'm reinforcing anyway, because I have the ZDZ 40 on board. Rear cabane was perfectly centered.
Ya'll done good!!!
05-16-2002, 05:13 PM
#45
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Ann Marie and GP,
Several of our club members have bought the Pitts, and all were very grateful for the heads-up from you. (I'm our webmaster and emailed everybody). You (Great Plains) have handled this very professionally and expeditiously.
I'm ready to order the Pitts- Is there anyway to know that the ARF that I get will be one that's been inspected and cleared of this problem? Is there going to be a recall of arfs presently in stores??
In the meantime, one of our club members has made a great logo for his Pitts and I've put up some caps and t-shirts (with his original design) in our club webstore. Any Pitts pilots are welcome to check 'em out. (If you'd like to set up your own free store, click on MAKE MY OWN STORE while you're there.)
http://www.cafepress.com/flyingcards...2,flyingcards3
Several of our club members have bought the Pitts, and all were very grateful for the heads-up from you. (I'm our webmaster and emailed everybody). You (Great Plains) have handled this very professionally and expeditiously.
I'm ready to order the Pitts- Is there anyway to know that the ARF that I get will be one that's been inspected and cleared of this problem? Is there going to be a recall of arfs presently in stores??
In the meantime, one of our club members has made a great logo for his Pitts and I've put up some caps and t-shirts (with his original design) in our club webstore. Any Pitts pilots are welcome to check 'em out. (If you'd like to set up your own free store, click on MAKE MY OWN STORE while you're there.)
http://www.cafepress.com/flyingcards...2,flyingcards3
05-18-2002, 06:26 PM
#46
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Bud,
No there will not be a recall; however, the dealers are all being notififed and addendums sent to them to insert in all kits in stock.
No there will not be a recall; however, the dealers are all being notififed and addendums sent to them to insert in all kits in stock.
05-24-2002, 12:36 PM
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WARNING: GP 1/3 Pitts
Originally posted by amcross
Bud,
No there will not be a recall; however, the dealers are all being notififed and addendums sent to them to insert in all kits in stock.
Bud,
No there will not be a recall; however, the dealers are all being notififed and addendums sent to them to insert in all kits in stock.
I'm going Pitts shopping this weekend.
So far 3 members have bought it and they all love it.
Bud
05-25-2002, 02:59 AM
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Forward Spar Cracked
Upon inspection of the forward spar tonight I found it was drilled to close to the leading edge and the holes were split. I'm doing the sugggested repair.Ialready have about a half dozen flights and am really happy with the way it flys with the G-45 on it,weighs 16#
05-25-2002, 02:00 PM
#49
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Cracked Rear Spar
Upon further inspection of the rear spar in the top wing I found it too be cracked much worse than the crack in the front spar where the screws went through it.
I sure am glad I found this out as I'm sure if I hadn't my Pitts would have been a statistic
I sure am glad I found this out as I'm sure if I hadn't my Pitts would have been a statistic
06-09-2002, 06:59 PM
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Re: Cracked Rear Spar
Originally posted by ce560
Upon further inspection of the rear spar in the top wing I found it too be cracked much worse than the crack in the front spar where the screws went through it.
I sure am glad I found this out as I'm sure if I hadn't my Pitts would have been a statistic
Upon further inspection of the rear spar in the top wing I found it too be cracked much worse than the crack in the front spar where the screws went through it.
I sure am glad I found this out as I'm sure if I hadn't my Pitts would have been a statistic
Thanks,