Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
07-22-2005, 05:14 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: MLaCoste
Okay, enough is enough!!!
(and it's not Gordon, Mr. Osborn).
Okay, enough is enough!!!
(and it's not Gordon, Mr. Osborn).
I just read the whole thread and did not see what Gordon did wrong.
Mr. O, what did Gordon do wrong or are you trying to feed fat an ancient grudge you bear him?
.......ghost_rider........out.......
07-22-2005, 05:39 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
Post #25 is the reply from Gordon that I found offensive however, as stated earlier I beleive the issue here is safety and we are veering off a different direction. Enough is enough is correct.
Over and out,
Over and out,
07-22-2005, 07:06 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: mark osborn
Post #25 is the reply from Gordon that I found offensive however, as stated earlier
Post #25 is the reply from Gordon that I found offensive however, as stated earlier
Post # 25 is your post and not Gordons. Post # 26 is Gordon's as quoted below. Could you tell me the statement or words you found offensive?.
ORIGINAL: Gordon Mc
That is simply overkill, and totally unnecessary.
There's nothing at all wrong with allowing alcohol on the club site, for legal and responsible consumption.
The issue here is not the presence of alcohol on the site (which is permitted by both the club and the landowner), but rather the operation of a model aircraft while under the influence of alcohol, which is already a violation of the AMA rules, and therefore (by extension) a violation of the club rules.
Trying to widen the issue to cover that of acceptable presence and consumption of alcoholic beverages on the premises is simply absurd IMO.
Gordon
ORIGINAL: mark osborn
Kenny,
You first must make alchohalic beverages, drugs and any other prohibited practice a violation of the club rules by posting a written notice in the form of a sign visible to all who enter onto the club premisses pursuent to all who are present on club premisses.
In addition you must make it known to all members by means of publication within your club by-laws that in accordance with the AMA safety code section 9, to support the clubs standing as an AMA insured, no alcohalic beverages, drugs of any other prohibited practice is allowed on the premisses.
Kenny,
You first must make alchohalic beverages, drugs and any other prohibited practice a violation of the club rules by posting a written notice in the form of a sign visible to all who enter onto the club premisses pursuent to all who are present on club premisses.
In addition you must make it known to all members by means of publication within your club by-laws that in accordance with the AMA safety code section 9, to support the clubs standing as an AMA insured, no alcohalic beverages, drugs of any other prohibited practice is allowed on the premisses.
There's nothing at all wrong with allowing alcohol on the club site, for legal and responsible consumption.
The issue here is not the presence of alcohol on the site (which is permitted by both the club and the landowner), but rather the operation of a model aircraft while under the influence of alcohol, which is already a violation of the AMA rules, and therefore (by extension) a violation of the club rules.
Trying to widen the issue to cover that of acceptable presence and consumption of alcoholic beverages on the premises is simply absurd IMO.
Gordon
07-22-2005, 07:31 PM
#56
RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
I can't do a screen shot but here is a copy and paste of post #25 as shown on my computer
: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver? - 7/21/2005 3:16:05 PM
Gordon Mc
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mark osborn
Kenny,
You first must make alchohalic beverages, drugs and any other prohibited practice a violation of the club rules by posting a written notice in the form of a sign visible to all who enter onto the club premisses pursuent to all who are present on club premisses.
In addition you must make it known to all members by means of publication within your club by-laws that in accordance with the AMA safety code section 9, to support the clubs standing as an AMA insured, no alcohalic beverages, drugs of any other prohibited practice is allowed on the premisses.
That is simply overkill, and totally unnecessary.
There's nothing at all wrong with allowing alcohol on the club site, for legal and responsible consumption.
The issue here is not the presence of alcohol on the site (which is permitted by both the club and the landowner), but rather the operation of a model aircraft while under the influence of alcohol, which is already a violation of the AMA rules, and therefore (by extension) a violation of the club rules.
Trying to widen the issue to cover that of acceptable presence and consumption of alcoholic beverages on the premises is simply absurd IMO.
Gordon
_____________________________
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." - Aldous Huxley
"He who establishes his argument by noise and command shows that his reason is weak." - Michel de Montaigne
(in reply to mark osborn)
Report | Post #: 25
Gordon Mc
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mark osborn
Kenny,
You first must make alchohalic beverages, drugs and any other prohibited practice a violation of the club rules by posting a written notice in the form of a sign visible to all who enter onto the club premisses pursuent to all who are present on club premisses.
In addition you must make it known to all members by means of publication within your club by-laws that in accordance with the AMA safety code section 9, to support the clubs standing as an AMA insured, no alcohalic beverages, drugs of any other prohibited practice is allowed on the premisses.
That is simply overkill, and totally unnecessary.
There's nothing at all wrong with allowing alcohol on the club site, for legal and responsible consumption.
The issue here is not the presence of alcohol on the site (which is permitted by both the club and the landowner), but rather the operation of a model aircraft while under the influence of alcohol, which is already a violation of the AMA rules, and therefore (by extension) a violation of the club rules.
Trying to widen the issue to cover that of acceptable presence and consumption of alcoholic beverages on the premises is simply absurd IMO.
Gordon
_____________________________
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." - Aldous Huxley
"He who establishes his argument by noise and command shows that his reason is weak." - Michel de Montaigne
(in reply to mark osborn)
Report | Post #: 25
07-22-2005, 07:37 PM
#57
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
Ben - my post does show up as #25 for me - perhaps there is a nuked post somewhere earlier in the thread, that shows up only for the mods - that in turn may mean that your post #s do not sync with those that the rest of us see ? (That's why I generally prefer using URLs rather than post #s)
That said, I stand fully by what I said in post #25, and I see nothing in it that is any more offensive than the dictatorial position adopted in Mr Osborne's prior post. If he had simply stated something along the lines of "Kenny - your club may want to consider banning all alcohol..." rather than telling Kenny that that was what the club MUST do, we simply would not be having this conversation ; there would still be reasoned debate over the best solution, but without much of the current heat.
Sorry if I'm causing you more work.
Gordon
07-22-2005, 07:50 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: Gordon Mc
Ben - my post does show up as #25 for me - perhaps there is a nuked post somewhere earlier in the thread, that shows up only for the mods - that in turn may mean that your post #s do not sync with those that the rest of us see ? (That's why I generally prefer using URLs rather than post #s)
Gordon
Ben - my post does show up as #25 for me - perhaps there is a nuked post somewhere earlier in the thread, that shows up only for the mods - that in turn may mean that your post #s do not sync with those that the rest of us see ? (That's why I generally prefer using URLs rather than post #s)
Gordon
You are right, post # 5 was nuked :
[Deleted] - 7/20/2005 11:50:31 PM
T. F. DAnca
Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at 7/21/2005 3:26:43 AM by ghost_rider
Reason for deletion: spamming the board
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ORIGINAL: Gordon Mc
and I see nothing in it that is any more offensive Gordon
and I see nothing in it that is any more offensive Gordon
07-22-2005, 08:49 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
Gordon, you said:
" I see nothing in it that is any more offensive than the dictatorial position adopted in Mr Osborne's prior post. If he had simply stated something along the lines of "Kenny - your club may want to consider banning all alcohol..." rather than telling Kenny that that was what the club MUST do, we simply would not be having this conversation ; there would still be reasoned debate over the best solution, but without much of the current heat."
I believe when Mark was talking to Kenny he was only stating the procedure that his club had to do to resolve the problem they were having. I do not think his intent was to take a dictatorial position. I know Mark personally and he is not like that. I guess he should have worded it differently. Sometimes it is easy to get the wrong impression because of the way something is worded when posting here. I guess I will have to go to Odessa and load Mark up and come to California and buy you two a drink. I have been wanting to come to The Best in The West fly-in for a while now anyway.
By the way, we had to ban drinking at our site also, there were a couple of incidents that prompted it. We had a member who would over do it on occasion. Once he fell in the pits almost crushing a couple of planes another time he stuck his hand in between the club presidents wife's b**bs. Being drunk is a good excuse for bad behavior.
I have also know of other incidents at fly-ins were drinking is going on after flying times were passes are made at other pilots wives. Moderation is the golden rule when drinking.
I myself see nothing wrong with having a couple beers with your flying buddies after the flying is over myself and I do not even drink.
Having said that I do not blame Kenny for wanting his signature taken off the individuals waiver.
David
" I see nothing in it that is any more offensive than the dictatorial position adopted in Mr Osborne's prior post. If he had simply stated something along the lines of "Kenny - your club may want to consider banning all alcohol..." rather than telling Kenny that that was what the club MUST do, we simply would not be having this conversation ; there would still be reasoned debate over the best solution, but without much of the current heat."
I believe when Mark was talking to Kenny he was only stating the procedure that his club had to do to resolve the problem they were having. I do not think his intent was to take a dictatorial position. I know Mark personally and he is not like that. I guess he should have worded it differently. Sometimes it is easy to get the wrong impression because of the way something is worded when posting here. I guess I will have to go to Odessa and load Mark up and come to California and buy you two a drink. I have been wanting to come to The Best in The West fly-in for a while now anyway.
By the way, we had to ban drinking at our site also, there were a couple of incidents that prompted it. We had a member who would over do it on occasion. Once he fell in the pits almost crushing a couple of planes another time he stuck his hand in between the club presidents wife's b**bs. Being drunk is a good excuse for bad behavior.
I have also know of other incidents at fly-ins were drinking is going on after flying times were passes are made at other pilots wives. Moderation is the golden rule when drinking.
I myself see nothing wrong with having a couple beers with your flying buddies after the flying is over myself and I do not even drink.
Having said that I do not blame Kenny for wanting his signature taken off the individuals waiver.
David
07-22-2005, 10:21 PM
#62
RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: mark osborn
Post #25 is the reply from Gordon that I found offensive however......
Post #25 is the reply from Gordon that I found offensive however......
Woket.....LMAO!
07-22-2005, 10:37 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
This dude MUST have been drunk! What good is putting your hand between the club pres's b**bs? Far better to put a hand on one!!!
Woketman,
You do not understand she is very well endowed. Her b**bs would touch both sides of your hand from your finger tips to past your wrist.
David
Woketman,
You do not understand she is very well endowed. Her b**bs would touch both sides of your hand from your finger tips to past your wrist.
David
07-22-2005, 11:08 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: Woketman
This dude MUST have been drunk! What good is putting your hand between the club pres's b**bs? Far better to put a hand on one!!!
This dude MUST have been drunk! What good is putting your hand between the club pres's b**bs? Far better to put a hand on one!!!
Gordon
07-22-2005, 11:08 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
He isn't a member of the club.
Where we fly it isn't hard to not be a member and still fly. The field is usually empty so no one is there checking membership cards. People could go out there, pound a fifth of Vodka and fly that neat Oly powered JMP Firebird all day and no one would know it.
This club is really laid back. They can be because 99.9% of the membership don't need to be told what to do. I have seen a guy that was an officer in the club pass the transmitter to me to put a trim flight on a Mustang because he had a few drinks from a beer. Perfectly fine with me and the rest of the club, you have a drink you don't fly.
We are taking steps to ensure no one gets into the field with out a key and a radio. It is an AMA field and as a member we are sure you are in good standings with AMA each year. We can only do what we can but I think a total ban on alcohol would be a bad move. Why change things for the membership that have been following the rules from the beginning for someone that is a not a members stupidity? Some of the old timers have been having thier evening beer together for the last 20 years.
Where we fly it isn't hard to not be a member and still fly. The field is usually empty so no one is there checking membership cards. People could go out there, pound a fifth of Vodka and fly that neat Oly powered JMP Firebird all day and no one would know it.
This club is really laid back. They can be because 99.9% of the membership don't need to be told what to do. I have seen a guy that was an officer in the club pass the transmitter to me to put a trim flight on a Mustang because he had a few drinks from a beer. Perfectly fine with me and the rest of the club, you have a drink you don't fly.
We are taking steps to ensure no one gets into the field with out a key and a radio. It is an AMA field and as a member we are sure you are in good standings with AMA each year. We can only do what we can but I think a total ban on alcohol would be a bad move. Why change things for the membership that have been following the rules from the beginning for someone that is a not a members stupidity? Some of the old timers have been having thier evening beer together for the last 20 years.
07-22-2005, 11:09 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: Gordon Mc
Uh Mark .. he actually mentioned the club president's wife's body parts, not the president's... but if you want to grab the president's ones instead, power to ya ! (If you like it enough, be reassured by the fact that the Canadians will now allow you two to get hitched)
Gordon
ORIGINAL: Woketman
This dude MUST have been drunk! What good is putting your hand between the club pres's b**bs? Far better to put a hand on one!!!
This dude MUST have been drunk! What good is putting your hand between the club pres's b**bs? Far better to put a hand on one!!!
Gordon
07-22-2005, 11:13 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
John:
Jalapeno Brats(Bratwurst) are an exotic pork and beef sausage sausage of Mexican/German/Hungarian heritage......which are grilled over mesquite wood coals and then parboiled for a few minutes in a slow cooker containing a slurry of Blatz, one of America's finest ales, onions, garlic, and cajun spices.......not unlike your Hagis.....
Tom
Jalapeno Brats(Bratwurst) are an exotic pork and beef sausage sausage of Mexican/German/Hungarian heritage......which are grilled over mesquite wood coals and then parboiled for a few minutes in a slow cooker containing a slurry of Blatz, one of America's finest ales, onions, garlic, and cajun spices.......not unlike your Hagis.....
Tom
07-22-2005, 11:56 PM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
ORIGINAL: Tom Antlfinger
not unlike your Hagis.....
not unlike your Hagis.....
Nuthin's "like" haggis , the great chieftain o' the puddin-race - aboon them a' it taks it's place, painch, tripe, or thairm...
07-23-2005, 09:23 AM
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RE: Is someone liable if they sign a waiver?
All this arguing and slamming has lost the main issue and point of the original post. What a waste of good letters and periods.
Jack
Jack
