Deandome

My Feedback: (1)

Just when I start feeling all warm & fuzzy re. the new Savage models (I recommended it to someone, a newbie, unfortunately!!!), I start hearing reports of some pretty serious chinks in it's impenetratable armor.

Seems like there are LOTS of leaky engines ("Did you gasket seal the backplate. This is a must and a problem with the s25. " ), defective, possessed RotoStarts ("Yep I've had the roto start button on both units stick in the down position"/"My rotostart button sticks, too. I bought mine at Hobby Warehouse in Palos Hills. I just saw a post on Savage Central with someone else with this problem. It really pisses me off to spend this much money, and have a static model." ) and throttle servos (and others?) coming un-centered ("also try to re adjust the servo cause the directions say to recenter the as they were not centered at the factory" ).

I guess anything's bulletproof if it never gets to the front lines!

Seriously, I know these are new models, and I know that they aren't fatal flaws that can & will send experienced hobbyists elsewhere.

But it DOES seem like the mighty House of Savage needs to get a LOT of sh*t together, and pretty FAST. JESUS, the 25 is supposed to be RTR, and people are talking about how (almost universally) you're supposed to remove the motor & re-seal the rear plate!!! That's a HUGE problem, especially for newbies. My god, taking it OUT is an ordeal, taking off the plate, re-sealing it in clean-room-like conditions & reinstalling (making sure all the critical gear meshing tolerences are re-achieved)....that's a boatload of grief, not to mention a good 2 hours of fun!

The RotoStart is NOT a new item, but they're still crapping out.

They can't set a simple servo horn properly?? And recommendations are flying that people "just" re-do their whole throttle linkage to make it better.

I'm sorry, but this all combines to make a compelling arguement that Savage is ONLY for experienced hobbyists, not newbies. A newbie (nor 20yr. veteran!!) should NOT be expected to have to have to remove the engine & perform surgery on it before break in is completed. An RTR should NOT require servo & linkage adjustments, or ANY of the other stuff, either.

Note that I am NOT saying all this proves that the S-25 or SS are POSs, or that this proves that the T-Maxx is "better". But it DOES prove that Savage has a lot to learn about making trucks that can be taken out of the box & RUN without years of RC/Nitro experience.

ThermalRD

Ya, i know what you mean. It took HPI a year to make 3 kits, traxxas spent 4 years, and gave the world a horrible motor. And that sticky roto button...Id throw it away just for that reason alone. And that backplate, thats nonsense. They could have done better. Whats with the empty fuel tank? HPI should fill that thing before it ships! The batteries need to be charged too.

New SAVAGE SS ALREADY RUNNING KIT!!!
Now comes with fuel in the tank
A running motor (tuned even)
Everythings loc-tite'd
Radio trim is all set

lol
Sorry...I had to...

RCBOZO

My Feedback: (1)

WELL I was all fuzzy inside about ordering one and I almost have the wife talked into approving the purchase of the Savage 25. I noticed Sunday night that ALOT of problems being posted. AIR LEAKS? BACK PLATES! I haven't given up hope I just might wait a little bit longer and see If these problems are resolved BEFORE I jump into a Savage 25.

ThermalRD

Dont get confused Bozo. The airleak is the backplate problem. Its right on the HPI website, they are using red loctite on the kits now. And the complaint about the sticky roto button is retarded. With that said, the kit has many upgrades. I believe they identify the kits that have been loctit'd with a red X on the back of the box. Check it out on HPI's site sometime. Either way. Even if you got the kit that wasnt loctit'd already, its an easy fix.

Matt

RCBOZO

My Feedback: (1)

This would be my first HOBBY GRADE RC Car I do not want to mess with fixxing anything! I realize about the Backplate problems and I can only Assume that If I order the RTR that it will be fixxed!

sp33dkills02

My Feedback: (11)

well all i have to say is i got a 25 and after a few days of hell fine tuning the engine she rips now man i run steady 265 on my temp and she rips no complaints other then it was hell getting her tuned in right and the backplate issue sucked too but i am happy now hoep i didn't jinx myself

kennebell50

As always when something comes its always good to let others get it first and see what it defects are. I have Savage .21 thats seen better days and thaught I'd get a .25, but after seeing its got this many problems I decided to keep the .21 and spend about $400 on it. I think I made a wise chose. Its now bigger, faster, tougher than ever thanks to the upgrades.

shorescurl

IMO, my first nitro was a kit, and I feel that if you can not fix a broken truck, then you should not drive the truck, and a kit gives you the experiance to do that. Not every company is perfect, and I am sure that HPI does not make the enginge, and if you check out the hpi site, they do make mention that the backplate issue is getting taken care of at the shop. The roto start issue is annoying. I think that it is good practice to make sure that everything is bolted down tight anyway, before you start the motor for every run. Remember all of this is just my opinion...So if you flame me be nice about it.

RCBOZO

My Feedback: (1)

FLAME? WHO NEEDS TO FLAME? I SAID THAT I DID NOT WANT TO DEAL WITH IT! THE TRUCK HAS BEEN OUT FOR OVER A MONTH NOW YOU WHOULD THINK THAT THEY WOULD HAVE FIXED MOST OF THESE PROBLEMS BY NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![:@]

I want to enjoy my new Hobby if I can find something worth spending my money on!

injectedsmile16

I dont mean to be rude but come on now its a small problem that can be fixed and if you read these sites and buy one then dont check it then its all on you. The truck is practically brand new and its not going to be perfect right away. I mean I could see a big fuss if it was a huge problem but its not a huge problem especially if you check HPI site and other sites then you know to fix it. Not every truck is going to come out of the box perfect and if you expect that then you really should find a different hobby. Just my .02

RCBOZO

My Feedback: (1)

Your right it is a small problem for HPI! If people read all of these problems that they are having know one is going to want to buy there stuff.

RCBOZO

My Feedback: (1)

OHHH I forgot to give you my 2 cent also!

injectedsmile16

They are fixing the problems right away, I mean HPI is a great company and they are fixing the problems so I have no idea why people make it such a big deal and they will continue selling the .25 because its still a great truck.

gHeTTo_SaVaGe

traxxas isnt to much of a listener either. There 2.5 should be considered a defective engine.... but they're not listening are they? the hpi has listened to savage owners and made a kit version and a better engine for the rtr as well as some other problems. Even before the ss and 25 there were many thing hpi did to make us happy. Like bigger and thicker upgrights, thicker dogbones and a slightly bigger airfilter. What has traxxas done after they made the tmaxx 2.5 to make us happy?

kanairacer

I dont think that the backplate and servo horn is anything to cry about. What is going to happen when you crash it and break it. or when you strip a servo gear? Are we going to cry about HPIs inability to make a crashproof and wear and tear proof truck? If you dont like it sell it. if you dont want to sell it fix it and stop crying...

gHeTTo_SaVaGe

and also the backplate IS a small problem compared to the nearly impossible to tune 2.5 and also the bulkheads on the tmaxx..... Im pretty sure some locktite is cheaper than new bulkeads or bulkhead braces.....

Avalanche

If you expect not to have to fix anything (regardless of what you buy) you are in for some pretty serious disappointment. It is standard fare to disassemble a kit and double check everything prior to even starting it up. If you ask any serious RC person, thats always step one in the process. These RC's are always a work in progress, even out of the box. Hate to tell you, but you might have chosen the wrong hobby.

TheMachine

At least HPI is admitting there is a problem !!...even putting the information up front on thier web site !... Does Traxxas admit to problems !? no feak`n way [:-]
All R/C`s will have thier problems and need for attention, and at some point you WILL have to fix them...and probally get dragged into the "up-grade" thing...it IS part of the hobby and if you can`t fix em then maybe Nitro R/C is not going to be much fun for you.
If you bought your truck at a reputable LHS they should be able to help you(and want too help) solve the problems..
Once the Savage is is set-up and loctited etc etc it is a great truck and will last a long time and not create major expense....in fact all of its issues are a $0 fix in my opinion...just a bit of wreching involved. My Savage .21 had zero issues out of the box.

TM

Deandome - Now you ARE just being an ahole, If you bought the truck your self and incountered all those problems you may be given a little le-way to winge and moan like a baby !, but to collect and re-gurgatate every other problem you have ever read on a board(issue or not) and create a post just for the purpose of trashing somthing and getting back at people who defended the Savage in your numerous T-Max is better posts, is damn right a-holeish... you obviously have a vendeta and love to argue...Somthing you should be above at 40 years or so of age.

ZipZap

Well, I couldn't resist replying here....

I have the Savage SS. It was my first MT; it was my ~15th vehicle over about 20 years. We thought that the RC-12's with springs in the front were the greatest invention ever!

I enjoy building the kits, so I have never bought an RTR. I have come to expect tuning and modification as a part of every kit. That's just the way it is. However, I do not expect any RTR or kit to require modification in order to run safely and reliably.

I'm generally happy with the SS. The linkage (now modified), diffs (now modified) and backplate (properly torqued when I got it, but now threadlocked) were, in my opinion, just changes that are part of this great pasttime. It would have been fine to leave them as is; now they're better.

The only complaint I have with my SS is the fuel tank. It absolutely changes mixture with level (last 1/2 is leaner) and applied forces (acceleration and right-hand turns make it leaner).

I have had problems with the rotostart breaking one-way bearings, but the rotostart was not part of the SS kit. A portable drill with a clutch has solved the problem. HPI should address this issue, as it affects all new .25's. A failsafe clutch in the roto start, or a lower RPM would solve the problem.

I think that HPI addressed the fuel tank issue, but I haven't seen any reports on the new tank, positive or negative.

The problem with some backplates is serious. I think that HPI should have had better QC, but they have replaced motors, and issued service instructions. I'm not familiar with the servo issue, but that should also be unacceptable for an RTR. Again, poor QC.

The bottom line is that anyone who purchases an RTR should get just that. A reasonably reliable vehicle out of the box with minimum adjustment. This option should always be available, as it is good for the hobby.

If you think that this hobby is just driving, you'll be sadly disappointed.

Deandome

My Feedback: (1)

I had to get through EIGHTEEN posts before someone came at me directly?? I guess it's because I cleverly (and honestly) did not slam the TRUCKS, just the "RTR-ness" of them & the fact that HPI didn't get a few major quirks straightened out before getting the trucks out.

Yeah, I'm sure there was a little bit of "revenge" in pointing out that the Savages had some problems. From all I've heard recently, the Savages were perfect. But I thought it was odd that none of these flaws were mentioned in the "which truck should I buy" threads, they only came up in Savage-specific topics.

Like I said, I am/was at the point in this "discussion" that I admitted that I woulda gotten an S-25 were it available, and I recommended it on one of those "What Truck..." threads without even mentioning the T-Maxx as an option.

In some posts, I talk about newbies & how they want no-hassle RTRs, but although I'm still a newbie, I've quickly reached the point where I AM painting a new shell, I LIKE tinkering & playing mechanic, I'm looking at maybe getting a mini-electric for winter use, etc. I'm becoming one of YOU!!

But I spend/spent a s-load of time before & after my purchase reading everything I could about all this, and I had nitro stuff as a kid. I guess newbie who makes it HERE to ask their questions might be similarly capable, and they might not mind performing surgery on a new RTR.

But these monster trucks are bringing the hobby out of the track "subculture" and into parks, neighborhoods-the "mainstream" -and lots of people probably are a bit over their heads when you start talking about replacing an engine back & centering servos right off the bat!

I think that is one of the main reasons Traxxas has dominated so much-THEY MAKE BUYING, BREAKING IN AND USING THIER PRODUCTS MUCH EASIER FOR NOVICES THAN ANYONE ELSE!!

Their instructions manuals are FANTASTIC-they have great diagrams, sidebar hints everywhere, and they educate you on the basics (there are like 4 pages on how a carb works!!)!! And that silly DVD is AMAZINGLY helpful!! They realize that selling trucks don't mean squat if frustrated newbies bring them right back, so they make the crucial & dangerous break-in/tuning period as easy & pleasant as possible. They also MADE SURE that the truck is truly RTR-the linkages, carb needles, tierods...EVERYTHING is set properly. Their phone & website customer service are top-notch, too, not that Savage is a slouch from anything I've heard.

People here don't care about all that, cause it's populated mostly by experienced hobbyists know their asses from holes in the ground. But it seems that this is the kind of site that newbies DO find & seek advice from. And just like I have had to learn that there are other & better trucks than my T-Maxx, all you "get a Savage" robots need to realize that maybe the Maxx is a good option for good reasons.

Dean

Deandome

My Feedback: (1)

That's nutty!!

It CAN'T actually change the mixture, can it (I'm sure you mean air/fuel mix, not the nitro/fuel mix itself)? I could see how pressure in the tank could change & that would affect the fuel flow. But is that the tank itself, or the engine/pipe loop that creates the pressure & creates the "fuel pump".

Would a new pipe change this?

Dean

DFF

Deandome,

I don't think you can call Savage "defects" or "major quirks" stuff that just need to be adjusted or loctited and cost absolutely NOTHING.

Please, be also aware that this only apply to Savage SS, as the Savage .21 can be run out of the box with zero problems.

Yes, you can be unhappy about linkage on it, tank or other small issues but the fact remains you can drive the Savage 21 like you stole it right out of the box.

Back to the SS, HPI even point-out the way you have to correct those small problems and is in the process of fixing them.

Not to drag the T-Maxx to death, but I think there is way more issue on the T-Maxx than on the savage.

For one, the engine tuning problem. Not something that can be solved with loctite or be fixed easely, even by a veteran engine tuner. I know because I tried and I came to the conclusion that the best fix is a new carb.

Another example is the shock caps. Not something that will cost you nothing either.

I think you are one of those people that are never satisfied.

Judging by your remarks, you would never have been in this hobby if you started 10 or even 5 years ago. At those time, RTR where not even created and you would not only have to put the truck together, but also have to mod pieces in order to have it running the right way.

The more you give to ppl, the more they want !

If ppl only want to drive and not wrench at all, they better go to the TICCO website.

No disrespect to newbies (I was one at one point too !), but a lot of ppl forgot about the fact our Monster truck are not toys, but high tech, high performance racer that can pump out 2+ hp @ an amazing 30 000 rpm and go over 40 mph over bumps and rough surface.

So, you need to be mechanicaly inclined if you want to maintain it, clean-it and fix the small day to day problem you will encounter no matter what.

Only my 0.02 euro

DFF

Avalanche

Very well said DFF, as always.

Have you been over to the new maxx traxx yet?

Deandome

My Feedback: (1)

Maybe...but then again, I wouldn't have a wife/kid/house to worry about, so I WOULD have had the time to learn the ropes

Two of the three items I mention ARE "defects" (RotoStart & engine), the servo is a flaw. There's NO excuse for RotoStarts crapping out, as that's not a new item! The engine, well, that can be chalked up to it's newness & the factory SEEMS to be correcting it as we speak. The servos coming "un-centered" seems silly. Note that defects both occured in Savage's version of the EZ Start system, a feature that was undoubtably incorporated to make the Savages more Maxx-like (newbie-friendly)! Perhaps it was a late decision to make this a standard feature, and that could explain the mfg. sliups!!

I don't think the Maxx has ANY defects, just a few flaws and maybe a bunch of "issues" THE MOTOR IS NOT BAD, IN FACT IT'S SO GOOD IT'S FUSSY (like a thoroughbread horse)!! I have NOT had any tuning problems, nor , I believe, have the majority of the TENS/HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of 2.5 owners out there I'm sure hundreds were defective and/or improperly broken in, but from reading this board, you'd think that 90% of the engines are crap, and clearly that's not the case.

Flaws are things that WORK perfectly (as designed) but coulda/shoulda been DESIGNED better!, T-Maxx flaws? The shock caps, though they are cheap to upgrade & mine havent popped yet. Bulkheads? Could be designed better, though I THINK it's more an issue of how & where they attach to the chassis, not the piece itself. They tie into the overall "issue" of how it''s not indestructible, that's getting to be a tired topic, even for me

I didn't make any of this Savage stuff up. I read (and posted) REAL Savage owners discussing REAL problems. I've also seen newbies express concern about having to remove & re-seal the engine back. All I'm asking is that Savophiles be honest about the strengths AND weaknesses of Savage trucks when responding to newbies looking for honest advise.

gHeTTo_SaVaGe

if you call a engine that need some loctite on the screws a defect and maxx bulkheads a flaw.... what the heck are you smoking? rotostarts crapping out? yes ive heard some of them are but its not as much to be considered defective by any means.... even the ezstarts on the tmaxx crap out. ive had a tmaxx for 4 months and comparing the two, savage is a whole lot better of a truck because it deosnt need any hopups to get it running like an MONSTER TRUCK only with some minor corrections which HPI has already done for you in the recent savage's. Traxxas? what have they done? all they do is blame you for the engine not running well and other problems havent been solved.