cardriverx

hi guys, ive been into nitro/electric rc cars/trucks for a long time and I was thinking of selling one of my cars and getting a little electric heli. I was looking at the helimax rotofly, and it looks great for the price. What do you think of that heli? I am willing to spend about 300$ max so do you think that would be a good heli to get or is there other ones that would be better? by the way i am a total noob when it comes to rc aircraft in general

jh4db536

My Feedback: (2)

with a limited budget of $300 get yourself a Blade CP or, if you want to take a smaller safer step, get a hirobo XRB.
maybe it's better just to buy a good SIMULATOR (XTR reflex or G3)

it's okay that you are new to aircraft, even plankers would probably have a hard time switching to rotary models.
IMHO i dont advise starting out with a RTF heli (XRB = exception; that's a heli with training wheels pretty much) i believe theyre more of a CHEAP fun heli for experienced pilots or a throw away for a beginner.

my take on the heli is, start out with a secure "RC10" of micro heli (actually it's probably more like HPi....the rc10 of heli are $$$). that would be the TRex or X400; however, you will probably have to double your budget since you are starting from scratch batteries & charger included. believe me it's not the heli that's expensive. The X400 kit can be had for a little over $100. It's the seperate components that will cost you [Computer Transmitter, head holding/anti drift gyro, Good Receiver (interference in heli is very likely to be fatal), reliable Lipo batteries, Reliable esc and motor]

a RTF will come with the barebones rate gyro, usually a shoddy Rx, and ESC all packed into 1 unit. they have TWO brushed motors which the tail motors have a VERY short life (maybe 5-10flights if you dont kill it first**will last longer if you know what youre doing). a TX that has no programming capacity, etc.

imagine driving on something slicker than ice in 3 dimensions. and if you crash it'll easily be near totalled. that's a heli. it takes a while before you actually feel IN CONTROL of the thing.

i must attest to mechanical/electrical reliability being a HUGE factor also. i have never crashed yet due to like pilot error or me giving the helicopter wrong inputs or even environmental conditions (wind gusts). my first & only crash was due to mechanical failure. it's critical and usually better heli have this stuff worked out. if you get the blade or ANY other heli make sure youve done all the "recall" fixes before attempting to fly.

if somethng quits in midair youre screwed no matter how you look at it. and it happens quite often just look at all the posts in this forum.

FYI im not even a very experienced pilot...maybe 2-3 months. i can hover in 1foot square side or tail in for the whole battery fly ultra basic circuits nothing too crazy yet. i went through 3 heli to figure this out. i started out with the most budget extreme and i ended up now with near top shelf components before i got a heli that would fly like i imagined.

cardriverx

well if i got the blade for 220$ and take it easy and learn how to fly it would it last alittle bit? does it fly good stock or are there upgrades that I should get right away?

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Definatly get a "aerobatic upgrade kit" and a decent 3cell lipo 1250mah....then the Blade will perform great.
The aerobatic upgrade includes a new motor, symmetrical blades, and heat sinks...for about 30 bucks.

It flys pretty well on the stock configuration, but flight times are short, and flying inverted maneuvers on the flat stock blades is no fun at all, and is difficult.

jh4db536

My Feedback: (2)

the dilemma with heli is that is difficult to take it easy and expect to learn at the same time. flying on the floor is DIFFERENT than in the air. and flying over waist high is 50x easier than flying at 1inch. problem is at waist high you have the potential to do serious damage. however 1 inch is hard to learn with youll be frustrated with these points: 1)why wont this thing stay in one place 2)why wont it trim (why does it keep going left and it's trimmed all the way) 3)why does it keep moving when it's level 4)is there any way to make this easier??? without solutions to these points you arent learning what it takes to hover and that's your goal at this point.

1inch is still prone to boom and blade strikes which are frustrating in the beginning. they can do moderate amounts of damage to a CP heli. with training gear you wont be tipping over, but it sort of hinders your progress (i didnt start actually learning until i took it off). for Nose in training i think training gear best serves it's purpose (this is way past hovering tail in).

i think the hardest part in the beginning is getting used to the sensitivity of the sticks (esp the pitch). 1 notch on the throtle will send it rocketing into the air and 1 notch down will crater it in the ground. a critical concept is also in reverse. people who know how to fly punch it to get altitude to save themselves. a beginner will drop the heli when they get scared (before learning to land). that's disaster. you have to learn how to take off before you can learn to land.

autoeject

My Feedback: (1)

cardriverx
I started with a low ($75) budget fixed pitch heli that I learned to hover on. I flew that about a month progressing without spending too much on parts. The fp heli's are pretty durable since most is plastic, blades included. Others have advised buying a good simulator. At those prices, I chose to pass. To be honest, I still can't fly a sim.lol After pushing my luck with the fp heli outdoors in the wind, I got a Blade CP. While it is somewhat more difficult to fly than the fp was, I am enjoying it greatly. It is still in stock form, but I don't feel it is necessary to jump into a bunch of mods till I'm not progressing in my abilities. I've had it for just over one month and have move into forward fligh. I'm hoping to upgrade to a nitro heli next year but couldn't be more pleased with the price and performance of the blade. I feel there is no need to spend alot to get started especially as helicopter flight will always lead to crashes. It does get easier however. I hope this will encourage you to take the plunge. It was well worth it for me. Good luck.
Mark

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Heli's are difficult to fly, but not impossible. Hundreds of thousands of people have learned to fly helicopters. You CAN be one of them.

Flying helicopters requires that you be patient, persistant, and that you practice LOTS.

You may be one of the few that only has nicked blades learning, or one that has totally demolished a heli learning. Its something that comes with the territory. One of the biggest problems is Overconfidence. Ive seen it time and time again. A new pilot "thinks" he can fly a helicopter, and the more experienced ones offer advice, but all their comments fall on deaf ears and a closed mind. Then the first thing that happens is he crashes, and then all of a sudden he wants help. LISTEN very carefully to your fellow pilots. 10 times out of 10, the advice they are giving you, is stuff they learned the hard way.

First do a search in here for Radd's Flying Lessons and FOLLOW them exactly. I agree with alot that he says. One of the best things that he said was that "bunny hopping" is NOT the way to learn. You'll be up and flying much faster with his lessons then anything else.

Second, be prepared to fix things that break. This requires a good knowledge about how to assemble, disassemble, correct, trim, track, and repair your particular helicopter. The information you need is right here in these forums. Dont just learn how to replace parts on your helicopter, but learn how and why those parts work. Learn how changes to those parts will affect flight.

Third, be willing to do research. Use the internet to find out things that you dont know. Most other heli pilots will help you as much as possible, but dont expect them to be at your beckoning for questions that could be easily researched first.

Fourth, ASK questions. If your having a difficult time, post in here what the problem is, and read all the responses. With helicopters there is likely 4-10 different answers to the same question. Be prepared to sift through them for the answer that best fits your situation.

Fifth, Go fly your heli. Fly it lots and lots and lots. The more you fly the better you will get. If it breaks, fix it and go fly it again.

Sixth, Always remember - A correctly set-up heli will fly correctly, a poorly set-up heli will fly poorly. Take the extra time to track, balance, and make sure everything is running smoothly. If something is not quite right. FIX it before you fly. Even a master heli pilot will have trouble with a heli that is out of trim, track and adjustment.

Seventh...HAVE FUN. Simple statement, but its very important.

cardriverx

thanks alot guys! I think I will go with the blade, maybe get one of the crash repair kit thingys . What kind of things should I check on the heli before its first flight to make sure it tracks right and is balanced? I think with alittle patience i can get the hang of flying a heli . again thanks alot!

jh4db536

My Feedback: (2)

1)equalize CG and balance blades
2)i would break-in both tail and main motors (water)
3)check blade tracking and adjust it accordingly
4)check heli CG and adjust accordingly


buy the aero kit...i guess it comes with heatsinks and thatll help the motors stay alive
go easy on the lipos, dont discharge them all the way, charge them slow like 1/2 or 3/4C, allow them to cool completely before charging
i dont know if you have experience with Lipo batteries, but EXTREME care should be taken in their handling (especially charging and discharging & crash damage) if one ignites it'll cause a chemical fire that wont extinguish under usual circumstances.

give the motors time to cool during flight

training gear, mainblades, mainshaft, spare tail motor...etc

the blade CP is supposedly test flown and trimmed out prior to shipment. i take their word for it. once crashed and something is tweaked, it's up to you to set it up perfectly on your own.

setting up the heli is SOOOO CRITICAL do spend lots of time.

for example : 1 twist of my tail ball link on the pitch slider determined whether my gyro would fly the tail the entire flight or it would have a mind of its own and wander around in flight, wag etc.

i started with a cheap heli and i totalled it within 10 flights. i never got it over 1 foot in altitiude. i could never control the tail which hindered me from learning to hover. the uncontrollable wagging & piroetting always forced me to land no matter how much i fiddled with gain. practiced the entire Radd routine probably three times or more with this heli and it got me no where. (junked)

my 2nd heli [x400] kit so i built it in a few hours, spent a week with the micrometer and digi caliper measuring all the linkages. spun it up and realized i didnt even have to touch the tail stick, tracked perfect needed no adjustment, no tail wag at 90% gyro gain (never adjusted it to this day), by the 2nd battery i was able to hover the entire pack and keep it in a 5'x5' area. i tossed the training gear by battery 5.

thecheatscalc

1C is plenty slow, any longer and you'ld die of old age... really any CP heli is fine, I'd suggest against the walkera 35, you can go with the 36 but you need a brushless and 2200mAh lipo, a bit pricy and should cost you $300 you'll never replace tail motors (1-3 hours flight time $10) and because it uses mostly shogun/TRex parts replacements are cheap. BUT on the other hand the blade is a pretty good buy and you don't really need a brushless system or big expensive batterys and it flys quite well once you break in the sticky collective. Fortunatly both are decently cheap/ built well, and are really just as good as the other. Walkera is a bit more of a risk on electronics, and you do need to go over it carefully but for the most part mine works great and can handle wind without much of a problem.

As for sims just download FMS and get orientation into your head, that's really all you need but remember that flying a heli is pretty complex and has four different planes to control instead of just 3 as in a car, although a lot easier to concentrate on as it isn't zipping around at 50mph like a nitro car.

cardriverx

guys i have another question whats the size of the stock blade cp battery? If i get a lipo i want to know what will fit so I can get the maximum mah. also what is a good cheap lipo charger? and finally will the stock eletronics be able to withstand an 11.1v lipo?

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Yeah, it will handle a 3cell 11.1V lipo no problem on the stock stuff. Ive been running a lipo on mine pretty much since I got it. NO problems.

cardriverx

ok cool, then whats the biggest lipo I can fit in it and whats a good cheap lipo charger?

thecheatscalc

well the chinese chargers they usually include in their deals really aren't bad at all, I hear they're actually built quite decent, but I've never opened mine. now for the batt I think the stock is a 12v (11.1) 500+/- mAh battery. with lipolys you double the size and quadrouple the mAh rating. my 2200mAh batt is twice as long as my 650mAh ni-mh batt and has nearly 4times the power at 20-40 grams difference (above) so looking at yours you could probably fit a 1500mAh battery on it (it won't fit in the designated spot anymore) with out much trouble. most pople use 1230mAh batts though.

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

1250-1360mah is as high as I would go. Any larger than that and you start getting degraded performance due to weight issues.

cardriverx

ok well how bout the polyquest 3cell 1500 mah pack that can be found [link=http://cheapbatterypacks.com/main.asp?sid=407940&pgid=fpacks]here[/link], about halfway down the page. its only 3.6 oz that isent heavy is it? As for a charger how bout [link=http://www.horizonhobby.com/Shop/ByCategory/Product/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLC3005]this one?[/link] Would that polyquest pack handle a charge at 2A? that would mean it would take 45 min to charge it right? Finally will a JST connector handle 11.1 volts or should I switch to deans? sorry if the questions sound alittle stupid i just want to make sure every little detail is right .

thecheatscalc

ok first never charge above 1.5A usually 1A, second that site DOESN'T have the cheapest batteries, look on ebay, yes it won't kill you and you don't need to worry about discharge rates much as you have a much smaller heli. go ahead with the charger though

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Lipo's should always be charged at 1C or 1 times the capacity...NEVER any higher or you risk explosions.

Example:

480mah = .48A charge rate
800mah = .8A charge rate
930mah = .93A charge rate
1000mah = 1A charge rate
1250mah = 1.25A charge rate
1360mah = 1.36A charge rate
1500 = 1.5A charge rate
1900mah = 1.9A charge rate
etc.etc.etc.

As far as chargers - I highly recommend the GreatPlanes Triton. Its worth the money, which you'll find out if you ever use one. Much more precise charger and has a much more informative display that really shows you whats going on with your lipo.

cardriverx

ok thanks, im used to nimh/cd batts where you can charge at more than 1C . Ill go with that charger and im going to use a PC power supply for a powersupply (I just started making it today). And thecheatscalc, I am problay getting the heli off ebay, so I might get the batts off there too. and finally will a JST connector be able to handle 11.1 volts or should I switch to deans?

thecheatscalc

jst? a pic please? you probably want deans because most other batteries use that right? if so use that. most connectors will work, your heli isn't hauling all that much power and probably less than your cars. just pick one and use it it'll work, unless the wire is under 30 gauge but that's just stupid.

cardriverx

a jst is the connector on the end of [link=http://www.horizonhobby.com/Shop/ByCategory/Product/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLH1061]this batt[/link]. It has 22awg wires, so will that be ok?

Traveler

Hey cardriverx,

My T-Rex 450X came with those and although they get a bit warm after a few minutes of flight, they seem to hold up OK for me and shouldn't cause any problems on your smaller Blade CP. From what I can tell, they should be good up to 15 Amps or so. I myself will probably switch to Deans Ultra-connectors at some point.


Grtz,

Traveller

bdavison

My Feedback: (1)

Jst's will work fine on an 11.1V battery. Thats what comes stock on the Blade helicopter.

thecheatscalc

yes those'll work, by the way the larger the number the smaller the wire, you want fatter wire, less restance.

cardriverx

ok thanks alot guys! im putting my rs4 up on ebay today (anyone wanna buy it? haha) and when it sells im going to buy the blade. again thanks for the help and if I run into trouble with the heli ill be sure to post it haha