Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
09-01-2004, 10:43 PM
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Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
I'm having a little problem with my Ys 1.10. This is very unlike the engine as it ran great on my extra. It just now that i put it on my Funtana 90 that its having a little problem idling right? I reset everything back to stock settings and am still getting those low end idle problems. The engine will rev up and go down and up and down until it eventually quits. As i saw on YS site it said to richen the reg valve but that didnt help. Its still having problems and revs and quits even sooner? Any ideas?
Its a pumped engine so i put the tank over the CG., would that have any affect on the engines idle. The funny thing is that this started a few days ago even when i had the engine running right on the Funtana but now it seems to go back and rev and lower rpms and then eventually die after a few cycles?
Its a pumped engine so i put the tank over the CG., would that have any affect on the engines idle. The funny thing is that this started a few days ago even when i had the engine running right on the Funtana but now it seems to go back and rev and lower rpms and then eventually die after a few cycles?
09-01-2004, 10:47 PM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
Fuel systems and other pics, in the thought that this can be easily solved lol!
09-01-2004, 11:11 PM
#7
RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
It could be a clogged fuel filter or an air leak somewhere, possibly at the valve cover. If not, then the low end might be too lean. Post a close up picture of your check valve showing the mark on it.
09-02-2004, 12:20 AM
#8
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
Eric,
This engine has been noted for having some kind of a problem with the pressure chamber gasket and, as seen in the YS Support forum, some engines had their throttle barrel ground incorrectly.
Don't waste your time and contact Dave Shadel of YS Performance, ASAP.
E-mail: <[email protected]>.
Phone: 775-265-7523.
You can also find Dave in the YS Support forum.
This engine has been noted for having some kind of a problem with the pressure chamber gasket and, as seen in the YS Support forum, some engines had their throttle barrel ground incorrectly.
Don't waste your time and contact Dave Shadel of YS Performance, ASAP.
E-mail: <[email protected]>.
Phone: 775-265-7523.
You can also find Dave in the YS Support forum.
09-03-2004, 01:40 AM
#10
RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
Mine did the same thing. After several flights, with the low speed set
at the 1 and 1/2 turn setting....the idle got to be too rich, and I had to
open the low end screw 1/4 turn to get back the nice idle.
FBD.
at the 1 and 1/2 turn setting....the idle got to be too rich, and I had to
open the low end screw 1/4 turn to get back the nice idle.
FBD.
09-03-2004, 11:14 AM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
I must be mistaking but there seems to be a fuel filter on the vent line instead of the fuel feed line. Could this cause problems with the checkvalve.
09-03-2004, 05:06 PM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
ganna try to mess with the reg valve. hope this works! Ganna go to the field for more advice
not many people fly the ys at my club so im on my own lol!!!
not many people fly the ys at my club so im on my own lol!!!
09-04-2004, 07:15 AM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
Sounds like the Idle mixture is lean. Turn the idle mixture screw in 1/8-1/4 turns at a time.
Try the adjustment procedure as given by Troy Newman in the pattern forum below.
RE: ys 140L <... (in reply to patternflyer1) Report This Post | | Revisions: 3 (Post No. 2)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regulator flush with the case...in is lean out is rich. Should not have to touch it!
High speed start at 2 turns and lean from there.
Low end start at 1.5turns and adjust from there...In is rich and out is lean.
Procedure:
Set the top end. Click or two at a time and wait several seconds for it to respond. The response will not be instant as the fuel has a long path to travel before it burns.
Then bring it to an idle of 2000rpm not 2200 and not 1900 right at 2000 with your TX trim. Watch a tach to make sure its 2000 even. This is a critical RPM as the motor is not being force fed fuel it is sucking it from the fuel system. Above 2000 rpm the pressurized fuel system is forcing fuel past the regulator and to the needle valve. In the first 30 secs of this idle if it rises up then sags out its lean (surges)...If it just slowly dies off its rich.
Once you make any adjustment on the low end...Go to full power clean it out for a couple seconds and then back to right at 2000rpm. Watch for same symptoms. If the idle will not trace right back to the 2000 rpm and hits like 2500 then slowly comes down to 2000 its lean. If it smoothly hits 2000 and then slowly loads up and drops off its rich. The first 30 seconds are the key to watch on the tach....Look for a little surging like 2000 to 2500 and back to 2000 this means your close and on the lean side.
Next is the regulator screw adjustment. Should not have to touch it.....If you do it will be because the mid-range is rich or lean. Same procedure as the low end but this time the rpm number is around 4000 rpm.....When adjusting the pressure regulator you will need to re-set the High and low ends.....As both will be affected. Max movement on the reg screw is around 1 turn either way from flush and most often they are turned in slightly from flush if you need to move them at all....I would say 1 in 20 motors or even less might need the regulator adjusted. And that is might! Go slowly and in 1/8 turn increments.
Key points don't run it too long on the ground. Once it gets hot you'll never get it set. If you are on a cool day like 70's its better. But don't run more than about 2-3mins on the ground. This will cause the motor to heat up past operating temps and you'll be chasing your tail. If it gets hot shut down and let it sit for 15 mins or so to cool off then start where you left off. Another key point is when setting it up use a smaller prop like a 15-12 or 15-11 this will load the motor less and make it work less. RPMS will be in the mid to high 8000's and this is good. If you really feel like you want to load the motor down...don't run it below 8000.....Ideal is 8300-8500. My personal opinion is run a 15-11 or 15-12 on 25% nitro is you feel like a 16inch prop go to the 16-11 and see if its not loading to the 8000 -8100 this is a little low on the RPM scale. Try some more nitro like 30% heli. If you really want to run the motor with that specific prop....Key on the YS motors is to let them run at the right RPM regardless of what the numbers on the prop say...8300-8500 will make good power on most of the props out there. So if you are running a 120AC or you are running a 140FZ Sport or the 140L....Run them in the same RPM range....No matter what the props are. Pick a prop that laods the motor properly. If you do this you will have less problems down the road. Trust me!....More RPMS and you are not loading it up and too low RPMs below about 8100 and you are loading it too much and will having troubles sooner than the guy at 8400...
Reg flush-low end at 1.5 turns and a set top end should run close. My suggestion is make adjustments till it seems reliable or is close then fly it. The flying will cool the motor off then next flight make a small adjustment to the low end and try it again......
Note: Too lean the low end bleed screw will mean the motor will not die when you pull a kill switch. Check the carb to be sure its closing and if its closed but the motor is ticking over you might be too lean or have a leak somewhere. Meaning the air bleed hole is too open and its leaking too much air past.
Another thing, you don't want a instant transition, where the motor screams to life instantly from idle to full power. This is a lean condition. You want it to smoothly take say 1.5-2 secs even though you throw the stick forward. This way the bottom end is a little on the rich side. Otherwise the leaner bottom end will starve the motor as you transition it. Remember it take a little time for the fuel that is going thru the needle valve and into the carb to reach the fire. If you are setup for an instant transition then when you throw the barrel open it will be instantly lean then catch and go. This can cause un-do wear and tear on the piston-ring and liner, also it can lead to an occasional backfire and cause other damage.
Hope this helps
Troy Newman
< Message edited by tnewman -- 9/21/2003 11:51:22 PM >
_____________________________
Try the adjustment procedure as given by Troy Newman in the pattern forum below.
RE: ys 140L <... (in reply to patternflyer1) Report This Post | | Revisions: 3 (Post No. 2)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regulator flush with the case...in is lean out is rich. Should not have to touch it!
High speed start at 2 turns and lean from there.
Low end start at 1.5turns and adjust from there...In is rich and out is lean.
Procedure:
Set the top end. Click or two at a time and wait several seconds for it to respond. The response will not be instant as the fuel has a long path to travel before it burns.
Then bring it to an idle of 2000rpm not 2200 and not 1900 right at 2000 with your TX trim. Watch a tach to make sure its 2000 even. This is a critical RPM as the motor is not being force fed fuel it is sucking it from the fuel system. Above 2000 rpm the pressurized fuel system is forcing fuel past the regulator and to the needle valve. In the first 30 secs of this idle if it rises up then sags out its lean (surges)...If it just slowly dies off its rich.
Once you make any adjustment on the low end...Go to full power clean it out for a couple seconds and then back to right at 2000rpm. Watch for same symptoms. If the idle will not trace right back to the 2000 rpm and hits like 2500 then slowly comes down to 2000 its lean. If it smoothly hits 2000 and then slowly loads up and drops off its rich. The first 30 seconds are the key to watch on the tach....Look for a little surging like 2000 to 2500 and back to 2000 this means your close and on the lean side.
Next is the regulator screw adjustment. Should not have to touch it.....If you do it will be because the mid-range is rich or lean. Same procedure as the low end but this time the rpm number is around 4000 rpm.....When adjusting the pressure regulator you will need to re-set the High and low ends.....As both will be affected. Max movement on the reg screw is around 1 turn either way from flush and most often they are turned in slightly from flush if you need to move them at all....I would say 1 in 20 motors or even less might need the regulator adjusted. And that is might! Go slowly and in 1/8 turn increments.
Key points don't run it too long on the ground. Once it gets hot you'll never get it set. If you are on a cool day like 70's its better. But don't run more than about 2-3mins on the ground. This will cause the motor to heat up past operating temps and you'll be chasing your tail. If it gets hot shut down and let it sit for 15 mins or so to cool off then start where you left off. Another key point is when setting it up use a smaller prop like a 15-12 or 15-11 this will load the motor less and make it work less. RPMS will be in the mid to high 8000's and this is good. If you really feel like you want to load the motor down...don't run it below 8000.....Ideal is 8300-8500. My personal opinion is run a 15-11 or 15-12 on 25% nitro is you feel like a 16inch prop go to the 16-11 and see if its not loading to the 8000 -8100 this is a little low on the RPM scale. Try some more nitro like 30% heli. If you really want to run the motor with that specific prop....Key on the YS motors is to let them run at the right RPM regardless of what the numbers on the prop say...8300-8500 will make good power on most of the props out there. So if you are running a 120AC or you are running a 140FZ Sport or the 140L....Run them in the same RPM range....No matter what the props are. Pick a prop that laods the motor properly. If you do this you will have less problems down the road. Trust me!....More RPMS and you are not loading it up and too low RPMs below about 8100 and you are loading it too much and will having troubles sooner than the guy at 8400...
Reg flush-low end at 1.5 turns and a set top end should run close. My suggestion is make adjustments till it seems reliable or is close then fly it. The flying will cool the motor off then next flight make a small adjustment to the low end and try it again......
Note: Too lean the low end bleed screw will mean the motor will not die when you pull a kill switch. Check the carb to be sure its closing and if its closed but the motor is ticking over you might be too lean or have a leak somewhere. Meaning the air bleed hole is too open and its leaking too much air past.
Another thing, you don't want a instant transition, where the motor screams to life instantly from idle to full power. This is a lean condition. You want it to smoothly take say 1.5-2 secs even though you throw the stick forward. This way the bottom end is a little on the rich side. Otherwise the leaner bottom end will starve the motor as you transition it. Remember it take a little time for the fuel that is going thru the needle valve and into the carb to reach the fire. If you are setup for an instant transition then when you throw the barrel open it will be instantly lean then catch and go. This can cause un-do wear and tear on the piston-ring and liner, also it can lead to an occasional backfire and cause other damage.
Hope this helps
Troy Newman
< Message edited by tnewman -- 9/21/2003 11:51:22 PM >
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09-04-2004, 11:35 PM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
it was the regulator valve. i put everything back to stock( 1 1/2 on both high and low speed needles. and a flush screw on the reg valve. It started but after a full throttle to an idle it quit(lost rpm's) i put the reg 1/2 turn in and bam, she came back to life!!!!(two adjustments of 1/4 and 1/4) After a few high speed needle valve adjustments and a few endpoint adjustments and a a little low speed valve adjsustment and YAHOO that baby came roaring back to a YS i knew!! Da** i love that engine!!!!!!!! Thanks for the advice!
its a H-OOOOOO-VER'n time haha!
its a H-OOOOOO-VER'n time haha!
09-05-2004, 12:19 AM
#17
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
Eric,
It would still be a good idea to contact Dave Shadel.
This, just to make sure your engine suffers from none of the problems I mentioned.
The regulator, as the instructions say, is only the last resort.
For many earlier YS engines, the regulator was, more-or-less, the idle adjustment...
You had to adjust it.
It would still be a good idea to contact Dave Shadel.
This, just to make sure your engine suffers from none of the problems I mentioned.
The regulator, as the instructions say, is only the last resort.
For many earlier YS engines, the regulator was, more-or-less, the idle adjustment...
You had to adjust it.
09-05-2004, 03:19 AM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
ORIGINAL: DarZeelon
Eric,
It would still be a good idea to contact Dave Shadel.
This, just to make sure your engine suffers from none of the problems I mentioned.
The regulator, as the instructions say, is only the last resort.
For many earlier YS engines, the regulator was, more-or-less, the idle adjustment...
You had to adjust it.
Eric,
It would still be a good idea to contact Dave Shadel.
This, just to make sure your engine suffers from none of the problems I mentioned.
The regulator, as the instructions say, is only the last resort.
For many earlier YS engines, the regulator was, more-or-less, the idle adjustment...
You had to adjust it.
09-05-2004, 10:37 AM
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RE: Ys engine Idle, not like it used to, little help 4 stroke gods!
still contact dave???
Cool Cool, I got this engine a year ago at Christmas, so you think that i might have one of the earlier models that might have an improperly machined carb? It's running fine now, but that wouldnt be a bad idea, seeing as it might be the source of this constant tuning problem due to a simple airplane switch. I do have to admit i like to tinker with 4 strokes and tune things alot so it might be me turing the wrong vavle when i really dont need to. As they say for four strokes, if its running' n idle'n, leavie it alone!!!! Lol, sometimes i want that extra top end or that nice slow idle........I see no reason why people are afraid of these engines, all you need is patience, few resources and did i mention patience? THanks for helping me out on this somewhat complex issue that i seemed i couldnt solve without you guy's help.Im going to give dave. But the thing is you cant tell the difference in the position of the reg valve scew when you scew it in our out. I had taken it apart and flushed it with nitro thinking that it might have a leak and a peice of crap was it. It might not have been in the exact flush position, i mad it flush with the lip of the valve so it might of just been my lack of seeing "flushness" with tthe casing. Dont worry ill still contact dave today(after i fly, im on a mission to fly my funtana today after 8 trips of going to the field for mechanical, electrical and building tips and not to mention engine tuning. ) I hope i dont have an improperly machined carb! But i guess its worth it in the long run to replace it if theres a problem, to aviod problems like these that seem to plague me.~~thanks again for the help.
Cool Cool, I got this engine a year ago at Christmas, so you think that i might have one of the earlier models that might have an improperly machined carb? It's running fine now, but that wouldnt be a bad idea, seeing as it might be the source of this constant tuning problem due to a simple airplane switch. I do have to admit i like to tinker with 4 strokes and tune things alot so it might be me turing the wrong vavle when i really dont need to. As they say for four strokes, if its running' n idle'n, leavie it alone!!!! Lol, sometimes i want that extra top end or that nice slow idle........I see no reason why people are afraid of these engines, all you need is patience, few resources and did i mention patience? THanks for helping me out on this somewhat complex issue that i seemed i couldnt solve without you guy's help.Im going to give dave. But the thing is you cant tell the difference in the position of the reg valve scew when you scew it in our out. I had taken it apart and flushed it with nitro thinking that it might have a leak and a peice of crap was it. It might not have been in the exact flush position, i mad it flush with the lip of the valve so it might of just been my lack of seeing "flushness" with tthe casing. Dont worry ill still contact dave today(after i fly, im on a mission to fly my funtana today after 8 trips of going to the field for mechanical, electrical and building tips and not to mention engine tuning. ) I hope i dont have an improperly machined carb! But i guess its worth it in the long run to replace it if theres a problem, to aviod problems like these that seem to plague me.~~thanks again for the help.
