skyowa

After much internal debate, having read enough reviews to know that this tank might be a crap shoot, I decided to go ahead and get one to fill out my US collection, all of which are Heng Long, so it's not like I expected any better than Heng Long, what I didn't really expect was worse than Heng Long and in that regard I feel like that's really what I got. Out of box, smoke generator bad, one tail light with a disconnected wire, a radio with misaligned sticks that jam, and none of the sprues were actually marked, so the reference numbers on the instructions were worthless, I literally had to just guess and match which one was which, and there were a couple parts that just had subtle differences not clear in the photos, so I actually had to remove a couple pieces down the line to swap them. The turret also sits too low and drags on the top of the rear hull, more so with the fence and details like the tire installed, but of course the directions show it sitting quite a bit higher with lot's of clearance, I honestly don't see any way of correcting that easily.

The entire assembly process is frustrating due to having to pretty much custom fit every piece, and couple were a matter of "that's as good as it's going to get, biggest problem was how much paint they filled the holes with, but were skimpy enough to not even bother painting the backs that are exposed to view, and the "instructions" basically being a picture and nothing more to indicate order, and since the parts were not well molded, I ended up have to use a lot of masking tape to try and hold parts at the correct angle while the glue set and I was guessing at those.

Mechanically, compared to what I get with the Heng Longs, doesn't seem to be any better, but perhaps not worse, there's so many screws holding the gear boxes in though it's not very clear what's actually going on compared to the Heng Long's, and for $200 bucks you'd think they'd include a metal gearbox instead of plastic, from what I've seen the metal upgrade is just under $100, and that of course is a complete joke. Drivability is hard to judge due to the stick issue being a problem, but it appears to be far less smooth than my Heng Longs, steering is not all proportional and the throttle is not smooth at all.

However, the road wheels, albeit plastic, have rubber tires, that's a nice touch, kinda negated by the swing arms having no positive stops though.

Overall, for what I paid, in the same price range as the Heng Longs I own, this tank is a disappointment bordering on regret, there are a host of QC related issues that I'll have to address to get it operating decently, I suspect this one will be on a shelf more than the others.

skyowa

I figured out the issue with the turret dragging on the hull, the hull is warped and the rear section even with the screws torqued would not seat properly, a blow dryer and patience reduced it to where there's maybe 1/16" play, but nothing drags now. Smoke generator gets voltage, but it doesn't seem to get hot enough to vaporize the fluid, so we'll have get that replaced, but at least I can say I have a Paton. Was considering their Bradley, not so keen on that now.

tankme

The Bradley is oversized...some say it's closer to 1/14 scale because TongDE didn't want to source new gearboxes. They needed to increase the scale to get the gearboxes to fit.

Fsttanks

Who did you buy it from? I ask because different vendors order it with different levels of parts build quality. Also you bought the cheapest version available which almost everyone says not to buy. The metal is superior in mechanical aspects to the plastic vs and rarely have any issues. The metal version has bearings in the metal wheels, and suspension arms (32 in total). The plastic has loose fitting plastic bushing, big difference there.

The metal M60 has sealed gearboxes with bearings and steel gears. It is a superior gearbox to the HL stock steal gearboxes hands down.

I can say first hand owning five of the metal TD M60s that they are excellent running tank and with just a little paint and a few aftermarket accessories like a new correct M68 barrel a spotlight upgraded ERA for the USMC and IDF version along with other crew kit can turn it into quite nice looking tanks.

I am not saying the TongDe M60 is perfect and does not have its shortcomings, (namely it electronics which I replace with HL 7.1 systems) but it absolutely is a solid platform for building something rather nice.

Just a few of my M60s that have been improved with paint and aftermarket detailing and accessories.


USMC M60 with aftermarket "era" panels for the front, sides and top of turret. Also a a more correct aftermarket M68 cannon.

skyowa

I paid $180 for steel gearbox versions of the Abrams, Challenger and Leopard, had zero issues with the assembly and they run great, $200 for this cursed thing with a plastic gear box and nothing but issues during assembly and it doesn't run nearly as well as the Heng Longs, so in my experience the Tongde is just garbage in my opinion.

bowlman

I finally took the plunge and ordered from Motion RC the M60 myself got the metal version and also ordered the DKLMRC turret and hull upgrade package they now sale will replace the electronics with ether the HL 7.1 or something else already got a few LegoDEI receiver for Tamiya and HL systems will need to see if they improved the covers for the suspension torsion bars or if I need to get the ones Rich sales when there back in stock.
Thanks
Jimmy

Fsttanks

I know HL tanks pretty well having owned way to many of them even back when people hated them and said they were junk compared to a Tamiya or Taigen. Kinda like how you are compared TD to HL.

In my opinion you are in the minority because the metal version M60s run great. Mine can easily run circles around any $200 "modern" HL tank like the ones you mentioned above. Between our 3 clubs we have no less than 20 M60 and everyone loves them.

I am not saying they are perfect, but you did buy the cheapest entry level one not the metal upgrade one. At Motionrc the upgrade version is only $319 delivered to you door.

Feel free to visit my Instagram at Fsttanks or my YouTube at Fsttanks1 and watch all the videos of my M60 and my HL tanks. Then tell us the M60s are junk.

Fsttanks

The covers have been improved and the issue I reported early on are not being seen to the extent they were anymore. One thing is for sure TD is listening to our feedback and making changes. That is more than we can say about HengLong or Tamiya.

skyowa

You have your opinion, based on your personal experience, which you expressed already, I have mine based on my experience, end of discussion with you.

skyowa

I typically buy the cheapest versions of anything and then upgrade to suit and then start hunting for deals on any upgrades, the only difference between mine and a metal version is they swap out metal and bearings, the hull, turret etc and detail parts are the same, and that's where a lot of the problems came from.

Fsttanks

Ouch you seem angry. I can't help it that you are upset at a problem of your own making. You went cheap and now you are upset being called out for it. You just want to hate on TongDe based on your experience with the lowest quality product they make. Interesting...

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

I've been in this hobby longer than I'd like to admit. I have built tanks from the old HL with the am radio( Talk about junk), to Tamiya kits with all sorts of custom modifications, etc etc. Henglong seems to have come a long way from those days, though they are not on par with Tamiya in build quality or electronics.
With that said, what you said in this post doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I understand getting frustrated with certain things, but Tongde is a baby company. They have not been around for very long and they are still learning. You said the sprues and not marked. In the manual, there should be a photo of the sprues, with the corresponding numbers. As for fit, well, no, they are not all that great in the fit department, at least in the experience I have had with a churchill. However, they are not what I would call terrible, or junk. They are certainly not high end and I will agree with the electronics being sub par. (Still better than the old HL), I will be replacing the churchill unit with an ElMod anyway, so I don't care much about the electronics. It does run ok, and it certainly is very controllable and functions as per the instructions. I cannot complain there.
As others have said, the metal edition( I believe called Pro) is a much better starting point than the cheapest version. Buying that just to add all the stuff that the pro comes with later is throwing money away. It will cost you far more in the long run than buying it already built..
A couple of other points:
If the tank had so many problems, why no simply contact the seller and either return it, or get a replacement sent?
This forum has always been full of folks who are always wiling to help and give quality information. Well, most of the time at at least. But you seem to be of the mindset that if someone doesn't agree with you, you get very upset about it. You're forgetting that the folks here have alot of experience wit h the tank you are complaining about. So maybe listen to experience. The other issue is that you seem to just want to be right and don't care about the input others give you. So why post at all? This hobby is about tinkering and modifying things. I mean, the paint job on the thing had me laughing. They painted the spare road wheel and TIRE lol. These tanks require time and effort. They're not perfect out of the box. But they seem to make a real nice base.

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

😂 😂 😂 oh boy. No one gives a damn how you spend your money. You came in here crying like a little girl. People tried to give you advice, which offended you

See above on the issues that a "more expensive" tank wouldn't solve. I addressed that when I said that you could have contacted the seller for a return.
And oh no! Please don't ignore me!! I can't deal with a whiny little mental case not talking to me? Clown. Maybe you should consider putting your rc tank money into a teddy bear and VA safe place idiot

Rad_Schuhart

Jesus guys, why humans take everything so personal?

He was dissapointed with what he bought, and he exposes it. What can be fine for some, it is not for others, that is it. I think it is always good to get several opinions from a product. In fact, the more, the better.

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

100% agree with you. But I've honestly never seen someone on this forum be so nasty to other members for simply trying to give him advice based on the experience they have. His self professed experience comes in the form of owning a couple of HL tanks. Him being unhappy with his purchase, certainly doesn't equate to him being right, not does it warrant his behavior towards members for telling him the truth. God help us

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

​​​​​​You were the kid who got trophies for participating right?
You either can't read well, it you have comprehension issues. No one is telling you how to spend your money. People are trying to give you knowledge based on years of experience with these model tanks. There's a big difference buddy. You are defensive and you are miserable. That's a fact.
You still haven't answered or acknowledged the return to seller part either. Most folks who are sold a "broken" toy would return it and get a working unit or a refund. That would be the go to for for a solution.
You cannot comprehend when folks are trying to help you. You instead complain and tell us that your opinion is the only thing that matters. Good luck in your future tanking purchases.

Rad_Schuhart

Well, I guess he can be very frustrated or dissapointed, hence his opinions. I have not seen that model in depth, and the issues that he has found seem minor to me, but if Herr Ffstank claims it is a durable tank, heck, I believe it, lol. But, I don't know. Many times you only read amazing reviews, many of them paid reviews that only talk marvels about a product and then it is nowhere near what people write in forums.

As an example, some months ago there was a small fight here about the Henntek track tensioners that many people praises. I had nothing but frustration with them, and until that thread, I read very little negative about them. Fun fact is I have been in an RC event in germany one week ago, and everybody that had one installed experienced the same issues, even calling it a downgrade part. If they wrote in the forum, God knows I'd saved the money I wasted in those, and I'd have invested the money in Daryl parts. That is just an example, so I encourage all kind of honest reviews where all the good and the bad is shown.e

But for God's sake, to all of you, don't fight. That brings nothing.

RichJohnson

OMG henntec idler adjusters, downgrade is such a good term for the ones I’ve seen, yes save your money.

any way back to the M60 series.

I also have 5 of these things now, two are operational battle tanks with IBU mfu systems and the others are being built up into other variants.
Fstatnks, Rubicon99nd myself have written many posts about these TD M60s on various forums and Facebook groups and Instagram.

Through much rough use we determined the metal pro/upgarde version is the only one worth buying and it performs way better if you swap the very heavy metal tracks to plastic tracks, which is why I stock the TD plastic tracks to support my rc tank parts business.

Yes skyowa, the pro version would not have solved your problems you have experienced so far except for the metal transmissions. Those problems will arise later the more you drive it with the very low grade suspension the all plastic version has. Some tank models are easily bought as the plasitc verison and upgrade part by part and can be better than the pro out of the box. The TD M60 is not one, its best to buy the pro metal version based on many of our experience.

I’ve built up several m60s for my self and customers. TD continues to improve their designs but there are a few hiccups now and then. I have one turret basket that was molded completely crooked and is somewhat mashed and unusable.
To date I have not had any issue with assembling all the detail parts onto all the tanks I have built, one being just yesterday​, but I understand yours may have had Some issues however it’s not uncommon for many tank brands to need a little cleanup of holes and tabs to make the parts fit properly, not just Tongde.

As for the warped upper hull deck, yes many of the tanks I have built up, the upper hull deck has been warped when unscrewed. However when properly aligned and screw back down, it has never been an issued for any of the tanks I have built so you may want to check to make sure it’s all lined up right when you screwed it back together​​​​​​.

i really like the TD M60 series as they are quite good enough and when detailed out with my aftermarket detail parts they really make a nice looking model tank and a metal pro with plastic track properly tensioned and set up is just an awesome performing rc tank. I have driven mine very hard off road and they just perform better than almost anything else. I have many videos of them in YouTube and Instagram and Facebook of them tearing up the dirt on hills ravines and even in deep snow.

oh another thing, dump that tiny battery they come with and go with at least an 8,4v battery or better a 9.6. The tank just totally comes to life at the 8.4v and higher rating. This does not include the low grade 8.4v LIon battery it came with. I mean a Nimh or LiPo or your preferred type.
and to make good use of a bigger battery and charging it, Rubicon99 on Hobbysquawk came up with a great rear panel magnet modification to access the battery plug to charge it in the tank. Yes in the tank, for those batteries in which are safe to charge inside an RC model.

Oh, also, the TD mfu is decent enough to use for fun, but the tanks really perform better with a henglong 7.1 system retrofitted in, especially if you want to IR battle with HL tanks, the TD just don’t do IR well at all.

Good luck with your tank, if you return it, I suggest you buy a pro next time (based on my experience with many of these m60s) which you will notice the performance once it’s out in the field. But that won’t change your problems with the detail parts. That’s just a learning curve of building models.
https://www.youtube.com/@RichJohnsonVideos/videos

RichJohnson

Well, you pointed out the plastic gear boxes were quite low grade, the pro version comes with the metal tranys and the higher cost is just a bit more than the cost of new metal tranys purchased after market, shipped and then installed.

Also, what motion does not advertise, the basic plastic m60 comes with metal road wheel arms that are retained with nylon or white plastic bushings in the hull. They have so far been found to be very sloppy and attribute to track issues. The Pro version comes with ball bearings on the road wheel arms in the hull, two per arm.

Also you get metal sprockets. I’ve seen a couple plastic sprockets on the basic m60 break. The pro also has metal wheels with ball bearings.

So you see, there is a great difference between the quality of the basic and the pro versions.


I am just saying there is quite a quality difference in the running chassis between the basic and pro versions of the TD M60 at Motion RC.
The basic versions have operational problems due to the lower grade hardware in the tank model. I understand you have not driven your tank much if at all yet, but when you do you will experience what some of us are talking about.

When you start driving that basic version you are almost certain to have a lot of problems with it and will get frustrated and start declaring it an absolute piece of junk, which many of us halve already declared and tried to let everyone know not to buy the basic plastic version.

I don’t want other people in our hobby to read this and future reviews you may post and come away believing the TD M60 is junk, The basic version not robust and reliable, while the pro metal version is quite the opposite at a darn good performing RC tank after a couple adjustments as demonstrated by several of us on this thread through videos on other social media.

If you don’t care for some of the toyish details on the tank, that is why myself and DKLM and possibly others I am not yet aware of, have been producing detailed upgrade parts to make the tanks look more scale model like.

I don’t personally care what you spend or your budget, the reason some of us are insistent about not purchasing the basic version is to save people from throwing money away on the basic version the pro is very much worth the extra dollars.

Fsttanks

WoW a whole 6 Heng Long tanks! That's a lot of experience...🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

bowlman

They deliver fast to I got mine 2 days after ordering it

bowlman

I did the same at one time been into this hobby sense 2008 and figured out by the time I looked up and got the upgrades it cost me more in the long run then buying the mostly upgraded tank in the first place then I buy the other after market up grades if needed as I go along now i'm into 3d printing tanks and tank parts . I still have just as much fun building them as I did over 10 years ago am no longer in a club as the club I was in disbanded do to everyones life changes over time for one thing or another mine was a job change and no longer having weekends off and the 1 1/2 hours travel time to the meet kind of killed it when only off 1 day aweek and in the middle of the week at that if you choose to get the least expensive or the most costly tank is up to what each individual can aford or is willing to pay i'm at that point in my life were ill be retiring in a few years so i'm slowing in the next couple years on 3d printers and tank purchases as the funds will dry up .
Thanks
Jimmy

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

I understand the being frustrated thing, but these forums are designed to help folks through that by giving guidance as we were by those who were doing this stuff before us. However, when someone comes on with a miserable attitude, and wants to attack anyone for telling him the truth, then he deserves to throw his money away. He's an expert because he worked on 6 HL tanks. I won't even go into the builds I have done as many of you already know. No one here was being disrespectful to him either. Everyone gave sound, and factual advice based on real experience with these models. A normal person would call the seller, which absolutely gives you 30 days to return it. No questions asked. He claims nothing fits right. The upper hull is warped "1/4 inch" A 1/4 inch? Why would you even mess with it instead of sending it back? He is either a troll or a clown. Rich and others gave him the absolute truth, right down to the differences in the versions, and still he is not happy. I'm not fighting with him, I am simply speaking the truth. He is talking about folks being mad about a plastic tank. Only person upset here is the original poster.
I haven't been on here in some time now, and if this is what it has become, well lol
On a brighter note, glad to see you and the others again. I have myself a Churchil and a stuart to mess with. I think I'll go put an ElMod in my 100 dollar stuart ad my 389 dollar PRO version Churchill because why not?

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Ya'll play nice.

Just because you change something to "xyz" doesn't mean I can't see what you originally posted.

RichJohnson

Woh.
Dude, Skyowa, clam down man, if you post rude stuff they will likely ban you from the forum, I suggest an edit, quickly.
We are a small hobby and there are not many outlets to converse over builds and issues and help etc.