green river rc

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What kind of manovers can you do with a non aerobatic type plane, such as a Cub or a multi engine bomber. How would you keep from getting dizzy? I guess the same question goes for C/L racing. I have seen and even done a little bit of stunting and can usually keep from getting TO dizzy, but have never been exposed to scale or racing.

gcb

You can add throttle to do landings and touch and goes, drop bombs, have retracts. You can have any mechanical set-up you can imagine except I think it has to be activated through the control lines. Check the AMA rule book for that.
Throttle is/was accomplished through a third line. I'm hearing that some are sending digital pulses through the lines like an RC unit except it is transmitted through the control lines instead of through an antenna.
Lots of possibilities.

Note that this is only from reading about them. Perhaps someone will jump in who actually participated in that event.

George

R8893

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Green river rc,
gcb is right in what he posted. A full competition routine can be done with no other functions besides throttle. Additional maneuvers besides what George mentioned include taxi, missed approach, high flight, and throttle control itself. The AMA special interest group for scale is called National Association of Scale Aeromodelers and their website has an article by Mike Welshans describing all of the C/L scale events. [link]http://www.NASAscale.org[/link] I have been flying my C/L scale models with electronic control. I use the direct servo control function in a JR radio system. One of the flying lines has to be insulated (fishing leader wire). Basically I have a direct servo control cable that is about 65' long. There are also purpose built systems available that include the control levers in the handle. The three-line mechanical throttle systems and special handle are available from Brodak.

I can't tell you how to prevent dizziness. I guess in over forty years of flying C/L I have gotten used to it. A couple years ago my first flight of the year, after the Winter layoff, was on one of my race planes. Bad idea, I got dizzy but quickly got used to it.

My atlas doesn't show Raywick, KY. Where is it? I know C/L scale guys in KY, southern IN, and OH.

I live in Cincinnati, Ohio and there are more C/L competition events within reasonable driving distance for me than there are R/C scale competition events.

Chuck Snyder

green river rc

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Thanks for the great responses guys!

R8893-Raywick is in Marion Co. about 65 miles south of Louisville. I'm always interested in the whereabouts of any C/L event. Cincinnati is not to far for me to drive for an event, we use to go to Kings Island every summer when I was a kid and ride "The Beast", man what a treat! If you have any info on C/l events in your area, I would love to hear about them. I think someone had one in Lexington KY last year and I missed it.

Thanks again'
David

2BFlying

greenriverrc
I'm not too far away from you-just on the other side of I-65. I'm in Sharpsburg KY, about 7 miles north of Mt Sterling off of I 64. My flying partner and I fly R/C but I am getting back into the C/L picture. It has become increasingly difficult to find places to fly our larger planes but I can fly C/L in the back yard, (4 flat acres). I also have a question while I'm here with you guys. What method of yaw is most used to keep the lines tight as you fly? Way back when (60's), I built the kits with a little bit of right rudder to make the plane pull to the outside of the circle. One or two kits I built had a built-up rudder which was really a flat sided airfoil to pull the tail into the circle to keep the lines tight. I guess you could also angle the engine to have the same effect. I am just curious about the preferred method these days if it has changed at all.
RWCherry
Sharpsburg KY

green river rc

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2Bflying- Where is your field? I have been to almost every field in KY, we may have crossed paths.

I'm building a Brodak Nobler that has a flat sided fin like you mentioned, I was as surprised to see that as much as I was to see one wing about 2" longer than the other. This old school stuff is kinda cool![8D]

David Thomas

gcb

David,

Next time you get over to Lexington, look up Lew McFarland. I think his shop is called X-Cell Hobbies. He has moved his shop since the last time I was in Lexington (my home town). He is/was only open on certain days.
Lew is a contest director for contests in that area so he is a good focal point.

George

2BFlying

David
Our field was a subdivision with a paved road thru the middle and no houses. Now there are houses and we found another wanna-be subdivision about 3 miles out of Mt Sterling. So far it is all farm land and a 3/4 mile long paved road thru the middle. We went to some of the shows at Lexington Model Airplane Club (LMAC)'s field at the dump on the Clark-Fayette County line and we may have to join there to be able to fly in the near future. (I'm talking R/C). But I can fly C/L at the house in the back yard. I grew up flying C/L and I still enjoy it.
Lew Mcfarland sold me my first plane in this area years ago. His new store is only about a mile from Hobbytown usa in Lexington. He is on Goldrush Road now and I try to get over to his place for supplies about once a month. He hasn't been there the last couple of times I went. I know his wife was very sick and he may have been with her.
I grew up with the Ringmaster faamily of planes and they were good. I never went to the contests but there wasn't much I couldn't do with a plane. That is why I want to get back into the C/L sport. I don't have to drive all over creation to find a flying site and it is getting tiring loading planes and all the stuff that goes with them. I began flying at the farm I had off a grass (pasture) field, but it got too rough when I moved to the larger more powerful planes. I didn't need AMA or insurance for there because if I DID hit a cow, it was mine. I had about 1600 acres I could fly over.
I'm looking at a TWISTER. I want 42-48 inch span that I can use a .40 size motor on. 62 to 65 foot lines. I might even convert one of my R/C planes to C/L. But it has a .60 engine on it.
Marion County, huh? That's in between E-town and Lexington. South of the parkway around Lebanon. Been there.
By the way, I'm at work and as long as nothing breaks I'm usually online here at RCU.
RWCherry
Sharpsburg KY

Jim Thomerson

Look around the forums and find out about adjustable leadouts (and also adjustable tip weight bozes. Get your leadouts coming out close together and in the right place and you won't need rudder offset, engine offset, or longer inside wing. Get the tip weight right too, of course. People do sometimes run a touch of one or all three offsets, but nothing like the "Good Ole Days". A Sig Twister is a good airplane for a 40. Balance it at 1 5/8 back of the leading edge and it will fly really well. The Twister lite ply tips are easy to do adjustable leadouts and also adjusable weight box.

I've been flying a Tower 40 with a venturi and spraybar and I really like it. It would be a good engine for a Twister.

Jim

clscale-RCU

My Feedback: (7)

Jim,

Chuck is right about the JR system, I fly with that system also. I have a book on CL scale and electronic controls if you are interested (send me a message thru RC universe). In terms of options sport scale requires the following.

1) takeoff
2) 10 level laps
3) Option 1
4) Option 2
5) Option 3
6) Option 4
7) Option 5
8) Option 6
9) Realism (judge thru the whole flight)
10) landing

Sport scale allows touch and go and Taxi to be counted as two options
Throttle counts as an option
Flaps are an easy great option, hard to screw up
30 degree high flight is an easy one

It is up to the pilot to determine what 6 options they will pick, based upon the aircraft they are flying. But remember if you try to perform a outside loop with a DC-3 in scale competition some judges may give you a hard time because the real DC-3 did not typically perform an outside loop. Bottom line look for things that move in flight on the aircraft you are modelling. For example the P-51 mustang you can pick from the following: retractable gear, open and close radiator scoop door, flaps, move canopy, you get the idea.

Don't build a CL scale model unless you are going to install throttle control, either 3-line or electronic controls. It is hard to score well in competition without throttle control. Here is an suggestion for a piper Cub or any model with throttle control only

Takeoff
10 level laps

throttle control
Touch
Go
30 degree high flight or Flaps if you have them
Taxi (part 1)
Taxi (part 2)

Realism
Landing

Hope this helps,
Fred Cronenwett
Wichita, KS

green river rc

My Feedback: (2)

I do know Lew McFarland and his shop, I don't get to Lexington much but I do stop in to see him whenever I can. I understand that he is the 1961 Jim Walker Cup Champion, and did it with an original design called the SHARK 45. I have been to the LMAC field several times as well, we flew heli's there last October. I noticed they have a nice C/L circle but haven't flown on it yet.

Thanks everyone for the input.

2BFlying

David
Does Lew sell any C/L stuff? I have always been in there to get R/C supplies and I really never noticed whether or not he had kits for C/L. It is hard for me to get in touch with the store there because of my work schedule, I usually get home about 3 to 4 in the AM. I am probably going to order a kit from Virginia Hobby Sport unless EXCELLO has something in stock. Who do you get most of your C/L stuff from?
RWCherry
Sharpsburg KY

green river rc

My Feedback: (2)

The last time I was in there he had some of his kits, (Shark 45, Ruffie and some others) and maybe some bell cranks and things. He is mostly R/C. I get most of my C/L stuff from www.brodak.com. If you don't know about them, you are in for a real treat. There are some others out there also but Brodak is the only one I have ordered from and can vouch for.

When is the next fly-in in our area?

2BFlying

David
I don't know when the next fly-in is for LMAC. I think it will be in the spring. They Just recently had a swap meet in the National Guard Armory in Lexington but I didn't make it. I haven't checked their schedule of events for a while. My hanger at the current time has a retired trainer in it, a RAZZLE with a TT61 on it, an ADVANCE 40 low wing, and a SUPER CHIPMUNK with a OS 91 Surpass 4 stroke, all R/C and came from Lew. But I still want to go back to C/L and pick up where I left off in the late 60's.

kdheath

In fact, it turns out that right rudder and right thrust make line tension worse, not better. They both yaw the plane out, creating more drag, slowing the plane down and causing line slack. Use the tiniest amount of right rudder and thrust to make sure there isn't any left offset and go fly. The Rabe Rudder, used in some high tech stunt models, actually moves left in some situations to correct yaw and improve line tension.

telmore

http://f4bscale.worldonline.co.uk/

clscale-RCU

My Feedback: (7)

Also forgot to mention...

Brodak is the only one I know that offers a kit identified as a CL scale kit. But you can take any RC plans or RC kit and convert it for CL scale. All of my airplanes were advertised as RC scale models, but they are all flown as CL models. I try to keep all of my CL scale models 70" span or smaller, I have a flown a 1/4 scale model for CL scale but that beast weighed 19 lbs. The rules allow you to go up to 20 lbs, but they get hard to handle above 12 lbs and 70" span for my taste...good luck

Also consider getting and ARF for a pratice plane to learn the throttle system and everything else....

let me know if you need the details to convert a RC kit over to CL...

Fred

green river rc

My Feedback: (2)

kdheath-What is a Rabe rudder?

Jim Thomerson

I will partially disagree with kdheath. I have built a couple of airplanes with adjustable rudders and, just for kicks, tried them in different configurations. If you crank the rudder out you can increase line tension in level flight to a great extent. Notice I said level flight. Take the airplane up high and it is likely to fall in on you because of excessive yaw.

A Rabe rudder, invented by Al Rabe, is a rudder coupled to the elevator such that the rudder moves in a specified manner when the elevator moves up or down. There is a complete explanation of how and why on Stuka Stunt Works Control Line Forum.

Jim