A good second twin?
03-10-2005, 07:11 AM
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A good second twin?
I've heard everyone recommend the TwinAir as a first twin. My build is going well, but I think the glue fumes are getting to me. I started thinking about what a good second twin would be. Any suggestions? Either a kit or an ARF, not necessarily scale, and no profiles (real model planes have fuselages). What's out there?
That Gemini looks nice...
That Gemini looks nice...
03-10-2005, 10:39 AM
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RE: A good second twin?
Steve:
Sad to say, there isn't much selection when you talk about more than one engine on a model.
Many plans, but most are scale, intended to make big circles around the field, not to fling about in a sporting manner.
The Gemini looks good, it's an ARF, but it's rather small. Should be fully aerobatic though.
If you can find a Duellist 2/40 kit, it's an excellent aerobat, 'specially if you do the Mk II modifications. Or you can build the Duellist 2/40 Mk II directly from plans. See [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/my_first_scratch_built_Duellist/m_2556755/tm.htm]this[/link] thread - Lance Ledet has done a superb job on a Mk II version.
You can bash a large single into a twin by adding nacelles to the wing, or pull a "Twinman" and join two complete fuselages by adding a center section to the wing. Ed Moorman is completing one of these now, the planes Ed chose to join have a long fuselage and his does not look out of proportion as many of this type do. You can see Ed's new plane [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/Twin_Sky_Raider_Mach_II/m_2726526/tm.htm]here[/link].
Hope this doesn't discourage you, there are many ways to go.
Bill
This picture is my bash of a Hobbistar 60 ARF. Originally a high winged single, now a mid wing twin I call the C-3/10. wr.
Sad to say, there isn't much selection when you talk about more than one engine on a model.
Many plans, but most are scale, intended to make big circles around the field, not to fling about in a sporting manner.
The Gemini looks good, it's an ARF, but it's rather small. Should be fully aerobatic though.
If you can find a Duellist 2/40 kit, it's an excellent aerobat, 'specially if you do the Mk II modifications. Or you can build the Duellist 2/40 Mk II directly from plans. See [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/my_first_scratch_built_Duellist/m_2556755/tm.htm]this[/link] thread - Lance Ledet has done a superb job on a Mk II version.
You can bash a large single into a twin by adding nacelles to the wing, or pull a "Twinman" and join two complete fuselages by adding a center section to the wing. Ed Moorman is completing one of these now, the planes Ed chose to join have a long fuselage and his does not look out of proportion as many of this type do. You can see Ed's new plane [link=http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/Twin_Sky_Raider_Mach_II/m_2726526/tm.htm]here[/link].
Hope this doesn't discourage you, there are many ways to go.
Bill
This picture is my bash of a Hobbistar 60 ARF. Originally a high winged single, now a mid wing twin I call the C-3/10. wr.
03-10-2005, 10:58 AM
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RE: A good second twin?
That's depressing. I've flown singles for 17 years now and while they're fun, I really like the twins and multis--always have. Isn't NE-Aero putting together a Duelest kit?
I saw a Somethin'Extra "twinmanned" in RCM awhile back. Looked neat. I've got an older Somethin' Extra hanging in the garage. Maybe I'll put necelles on it and make a tri-motor! That could be fun...
I've mentioned before I have Ziroli plans for a B-25. I don't know that I'm up to the task of a scale aircraft though. Maybe...
You've gotta beautiful plane there! I would never had recognized it.
I saw a Somethin'Extra "twinmanned" in RCM awhile back. Looked neat. I've got an older Somethin' Extra hanging in the garage. Maybe I'll put necelles on it and make a tri-motor! That could be fun...
I've mentioned before I have Ziroli plans for a B-25. I don't know that I'm up to the task of a scale aircraft though. Maybe...
You've gotta beautiful plane there! I would never had recognized it.
03-10-2005, 11:33 AM
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RE: A good second twin?
Steve:
Thanks for the compliment on the C-3/10. It was my second twin, the first that really flew well. First twin was (is) my Tiggerkitty, a genuine scratch build, seen in my avatar. It's heavy and has to fly pretty fast, and the engines are past their prime. It's about 13-14 years old now, never crashed (knock wood - my head of course) nor have I ever crashed ANY of my twins. I'm really conservative flying them, single engined planes are another matter.
And thanks also for reminding me about the Duellist 2/60 Mk II.
A couple years ago I headed a consortium to produce a larger version of the Duellist 2/40, We banded to allow multiple sets of cut wood without each of us having to pay the scanning and set up charges, and by buying a large amount of wood and other bits we kept the individual kit price reasonable. We made and sold 50 kits. With the fixed charges spread through the entire run, the individual kit cost including postage and a royalty to Dave Platt for using his design was about $200 each. Remember please, this was a cost price, none of us had any profit from the affair. A commercial kit will no doubt be more expensive.
Yes, John Marien, Northeast Aerodynamics liked the plane, we have assigned all rights to him and his kit is supposed to be ready in the very near future. The prototype models are now being built, when they are tested and approved the kit will be released.
Bill.
Thanks for the compliment on the C-3/10. It was my second twin, the first that really flew well. First twin was (is) my Tiggerkitty, a genuine scratch build, seen in my avatar. It's heavy and has to fly pretty fast, and the engines are past their prime. It's about 13-14 years old now, never crashed (knock wood - my head of course) nor have I ever crashed ANY of my twins. I'm really conservative flying them, single engined planes are another matter.
And thanks also for reminding me about the Duellist 2/60 Mk II.
A couple years ago I headed a consortium to produce a larger version of the Duellist 2/40, We banded to allow multiple sets of cut wood without each of us having to pay the scanning and set up charges, and by buying a large amount of wood and other bits we kept the individual kit price reasonable. We made and sold 50 kits. With the fixed charges spread through the entire run, the individual kit cost including postage and a royalty to Dave Platt for using his design was about $200 each. Remember please, this was a cost price, none of us had any profit from the affair. A commercial kit will no doubt be more expensive.
Yes, John Marien, Northeast Aerodynamics liked the plane, we have assigned all rights to him and his kit is supposed to be ready in the very near future. The prototype models are now being built, when they are tested and approved the kit will be released.
Bill.
03-10-2005, 06:06 PM
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RE: A good second twin?
Mr. Bill
Thank You for the compliment on my Duellist it is greatly appreciated. This is my first build from plans and I am proud of it.
To me building from plans does not seem to be much harder than a kit. But the Duellist is not the easiest plane, it takes a little time. It is worth it the Duellist is a gorgeous plane.
Thank You for the compliment on my Duellist it is greatly appreciated. This is my first build from plans and I am proud of it.
To me building from plans does not seem to be much harder than a kit. But the Duellist is not the easiest plane, it takes a little time. It is worth it the Duellist is a gorgeous plane.
03-10-2005, 08:10 PM
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RE: A good second twin?
Lance:
You deserve every one of the compliments you've gotten for your Duellist.
As you have found, it is not for the first time builder even though it's not a hard twin to fly.
The Twin-Air 45 on the other hand, is an easy plane to build as well as fly. That's why it wins my recommendation for the first twin to build.
There is no real difference between building a kit and building from plans, it's just a lot more convenient to have the parts cut for you and all the wood in one box.
Bill.
You deserve every one of the compliments you've gotten for your Duellist.
As you have found, it is not for the first time builder even though it's not a hard twin to fly.
The Twin-Air 45 on the other hand, is an easy plane to build as well as fly. That's why it wins my recommendation for the first twin to build.
There is no real difference between building a kit and building from plans, it's just a lot more convenient to have the parts cut for you and all the wood in one box.
Bill.
03-22-2005, 01:27 AM
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RE: A good second twin?
Im building a conversion of the sportster 40 as a twin, and so far so good. It uses most of the kit parts, and looks great, too. I have never seen it, or even flown a twin, but everybody here has said it's a great plane to fly, as well as easy to build. The conversion plan is from RCM. Maybe it helps.
Mariano
Mariano
03-22-2005, 02:26 PM
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RE: A good second twin?
Steve:
Nah, it's not glue fumes. Just Stage One Twinsanity. An incurable, but fortunately not lethal disease.
The TwinAir is a good enough plane to take you through "beginner" and "intermediate" (Stage II) twinsanity, thus preparing you for scale civilian or warbird twins (Stage III). Shortly thereafter, your immune system (resistance to unreasonable purchases) will fail, and you'll have Stage IV disease, which requires multi-chargers and ancillary storage space.
Seriously, though, pay close attention to the way the nacelles on the TwinAir are constructed and attached. By reproducing that basic, simple design, practically any model builder can bash his favorite single engine plane (any plane) into a twin or even a tri-motor, and have a lot of fun with it. With a minimum of effort and shop time.
Bill: Have any of those Duellist 60 kits been built and flown yet??
mt
Nah, it's not glue fumes. Just Stage One Twinsanity. An incurable, but fortunately not lethal disease.
The TwinAir is a good enough plane to take you through "beginner" and "intermediate" (Stage II) twinsanity, thus preparing you for scale civilian or warbird twins (Stage III). Shortly thereafter, your immune system (resistance to unreasonable purchases) will fail, and you'll have Stage IV disease, which requires multi-chargers and ancillary storage space.
Seriously, though, pay close attention to the way the nacelles on the TwinAir are constructed and attached. By reproducing that basic, simple design, practically any model builder can bash his favorite single engine plane (any plane) into a twin or even a tri-motor, and have a lot of fun with it. With a minimum of effort and shop time.
Bill: Have any of those Duellist 60 kits been built and flown yet??
mt
03-22-2005, 02:39 PM
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RE: A good second twin?
Mark:
I know of one Duellist 2/60 completed and ready to fly. Of two others I've followed as closely as i have been able, at least one should be ready to go.
I have not gotten flight reports on any of them.
JOhn Marien has some of his kit version (Duel-Air 2/60) being done in prototype, they may well fly before any of the originals.
Bill.
I know of one Duellist 2/60 completed and ready to fly. Of two others I've followed as closely as i have been able, at least one should be ready to go.
I have not gotten flight reports on any of them.
JOhn Marien has some of his kit version (Duel-Air 2/60) being done in prototype, they may well fly before any of the originals.
Bill.
