efish

My Feedback: (5)

Hi, just when I thought I had my SPE 266 sussed out, I'm stuck.

Bought the engine used but in very good shape - I think it had only seen less than 10 tanks of fuel and perhaps 2 flights. First dozen or so starts were dead easy - would pop with a few flips with the choke on then fire within 3 flips or so with the choke opened. Over about a week, I put in about three dozen starts like that on the ground tuning up the engine and making sure my cowl didn't interfere with the operation of the engine. (And mainly just getting used to the engine)

Then on maiden day, the problems started. At first, the engine just wouldn't even pop. After lots of testing, I realise that the plug was a little faulty - shorted to the crank case, it would spark only every 2nd or third turn of the prop. Over here, the stock factory plug is a Champion RDJ8J Believe it or not, I can't get a replacement as the local dealer is out of stock and no one seems to have even heard of an R plug! . Well, I managed to find a chain saw shop that sold me a Champion DJ8J - the non-resistor version. So I got one just for bench testing. Well, straight off, I could see that it was sparking better and on every turn of the magnet. With the choke closed, the engine behaves much as it did before when it was running properly - "bump" on a quick prime. However, when I open the choke and start to flip, it will just cough a few times, but not start running properly. I've also tried an electric starter but it doesn't seem to help at all. I've also gone back to factory settings on all needles plus a turn rich/lean all to no avail.

I have three questions?

#1 Is the SPE so picky on plugs? I had been led to believe that the only difference between the R and non-R version of plugs was that the former were better insulated against noise. Why won't the the DJ8J work? Or.....

#2 Is there something else that's wrong with my engine or with what I'm doing? In particular, I'm worried about the EI unit but it seems to be producing good spark for every turn. And....

#3 What else can I try?

Thanks guys.

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

efish,

Are you running a filter on your gas line? if not, you may want to check the screen on the side of the carb. It doesn't take a whole lot to clog it up. I had a 26cc SPE and I couldn't get mine started and it ended up being the Hall Sensor flew out and was stuck to the case. Since your getting a spark your Hall Sensor must still be in place but check to see if it has come loose or moved. My little 26cc SPC was real prone to flooding and it would not start by flipping but with a start it would end up starting but it took a while. I'd always have to pull the plug and let it dry out.

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Hi Zippi, thanks for helping.

I'm running a screen filter on my fill line, but will check the screen on the side of the carb. You could be right about the mesh being blocked. I did think it might have been the Hall sensor so I've already checked that and it looks reasonably secure.

Got my fingers crossed, but then I must admit I don't think this is it cuz with a little effort, I can flood the engine and it still won't run. With my hand starting routine though, it generally doesn't get flooded. I know that if it doesn't pop after about 10 turns with the choke closed, its probably flooded.

I always thought the engine would still run a bit on the fuel in the crankcase even without a carb on?

Thanks.

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

efish,

The Brillelli 26cc SPE that I had would flood very easy if I didn't watch it. I would normally hold my finger over the exhaust and run the prop through about three times. Then turn on the Ignition and hit it with the starter and it would fire up. If I would run the prop through to many times it would flood and then I was in for a little work of getting it dry and starting over. Hope you get this figured out. Once you figure out what the trouble is, post the results.

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Thanks Zippi, I'm beginning to suspect its the EI unit. Checked the carb like you suggested and the mesh looks clear.

Also tried your starting sequence. Sadly, its the same result - pop with choke closed, no firing even when using a electric starter.

Will be travelling in a couple of days and really would like to get the plane up before then. Otherwise, it'll be at least a week before I get to try again.

Think I have a spare carb around somewhere. Will try putting that on to see if it makes a difference.

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

My Brillelli 26 is very prone to gas problems. I ended up with a filter in the fill line, a clunk filter, and one in the gas delivery line to keep the jets fron getting clogged. If they are clogged I had to remove them and wash them out with gas.
If its flooded open the throttle wide open and crank it with the starter until it clears out and starts.
Do not try to fly it with a spark plug that does not have an R in its number. You will not get your airplane back.

ez-e

i am having a problem with my spe 26cc engine.

I can get mine started with just 2 cliks of the throttle but if i try to go up higher it will stall.

have been messing with needles but i get no change.

anyone know what the factory setting for these L H needles

than you

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

ez-e,

Set both needles at 2 1/4 turns open. Fire your engine up and with a tach lean the top end until peak rpm and back off 1/8 turn. Move to the low needle and lean 1/8 at a time until you loose a good transition and back of 1/8 turn. Go back to the high end and reset.

subarubrat

My Feedback: (1)

I have the same problems starting, with the first flight being tough and there often not being a second or third one because the engine seems to get progressively harder to start with each flight of the day until it is just impossible. On the times it does start it will surge and surge until it finally becomes stabilized and then it performs great. But the thing that will make me trash an engine faster than anything is spending more time flipping than flying and that is where this one is headed unless I get somewhere fast with it. And yes, there are no air leaks in the line, etc. etc.

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

This is the symptoms I get when the jets are clogged. Get a superfine filter on the gas line. Remove the needles and wash them out. Reset them at 1&1/2 turns open

ez-e

i will try that.
when you say wash them out....do you mean the holes or the needles themselvs.

i kept trying to adjust the needles today.
i finaly got it to start at the high end of the throtle but the high needle had to be turned 3 and 1/2 turns from closed.
i had the low needle set to 1 1/4 turn from closed.
when it started i adjusted the high needle until it ran smooth.
i could bring the throtle down to idle but when i tried to bring the throtle back up it would stall at half way.
i opend low needle valve a little here and there until the transition problem stoped.
the only thing is i did not like the poping now and then at the halfway.
i messed with the needles some more but i realised i am already pritty far out at the high which can't be good.
any ways... i am back to square one.

i should mention the enginge is less than a year old but i did have a belly flop ia a farmers field.
not too much damage to plane but powdery dirt every where.
my plane was in a hover when the engine quit.
people where messing with the needle valve trying to adjust the engine before crash
when i took it home to try to start it the engine would start then stall right away.
i checked everything even took engine apart to make sure no dirt got on the inside.
i checked filters, carberator...all that. thats what led me to the steps i took up top.
even replaced ignition box and cables.

one more thing. the metal inlet tube on the carberatur that the fuel line hooks up to
spins freely. not real loose but enough. could this be a vacum problem for the diaphrams?

thank you

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Thanks dirtybird. Wasn't planning to fly the non-r plug (although the shop tried to convince me otherwise) I just wanted to eliminate the plug and EI as the source of the problem.

Got an OS superfine filter and will try washing out the needles to see if that helps any too. (EZ - I think he means both like we do with a dirty glow engine carb)

Thanks.

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

To wash it out I remove both needles and the diaphram side of the carb. Then I squirt fuel through the fuel intake and push down on the fuel inlet valve to let fuel through. Then squirt fuel in both jet seat holes. This usually cleans things out. Then I reset the needles to 1&1/2 turns out. Long ago I removed the internal screen.
The best filter I am told is the filter clunk you get from the chain saw shop for use in weed eaters. This requires a three line system to your tank. Brillelli has a 100 micron stainless steel that can be use in the fuel line. I use both. They are cheap.
If it still won't take the throttle try opening the LOW speed jet 1/8 turn.

Flyinhi1

Wow.....I just found this thread and it's like you guys are all having the same issues with your SPE 26's that I was having. I just sent mine back to Cermark yesterday after about two months of hair-pulling, fist pounding, potty-mouth cussing at it all while failing miserably to get this thing running to even attempt a single flight. You have all described the exact symptoms I had with mine. I went through the carb several times, cleaned and re-gapped the plug, changed out fuel lines and endless needle tweaking to no avail. I finally said to hell with it and started putting on a Saito. I'll let you know how Cermark handles it. If they'll just credit me they can keep that engine, but if they make it work and send it back.....it's up for sale.

ez-e

ok.....

i took the carberator apart, rinsed it real good in gasoline and i never seen so much dirt.
to make a long story short i set the needle to 1 3/4 for the low and 2 3/4 for the high when all was said and done.....runs great.

also, my friend has the same engine and he was having trouble getting his engin to keep running.
he set the needles to the same settings....runs great.

mine was mainly the dirt issue which is pobably why i had to set the high needle so far out to even get it started...3 1/2 turns before.

Thank you all for your input.

Ricky Blade

i too am looking to buy a spe 26 for a hangar 9 sopwith camel (small, light, enough power, reliable?) the camel has a huge cowling 7.5" dia and pretty deep too. any feedback? ricky

ez-e

i took the engine to the field today.
i had an expert listen and look at it.
it still was too rich on the high end.
we wound up leaning the high needle to about 1 3/4 from closed.
definitly sounds better and has more power.
still a slight pause in the throttle transition.

the end

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

Another thing to keep in mind is the ignition battery and switch circuit.

Run at least an 1,100 mah NiCAD battery on the ignition. If you must use NiMH, double the capacity to compensate for the higher impedance of this type of battery. Some ignition systems starve for current because of one battery or another's higher impedance (resistance). You can have a battery that is within the range recommended by the manufacturer, but of the wrong type, that will starve the ignition system and cause quirky operation.

Ditto ignition circuit switches and connectors. New switches should be okay, but sometimes they are not. Check them for continuity and quirkiness with a DVM and know for sure that they are working as advertised. Do not try to check them "in circuit". Remove any power attached to them and be sure that they are not connected to the ignition module while checking them for continuity.

Also be sure that your charging circuit for your model's various batteries is not on a switched outlet. This has caused the demise of many, many R/C aircraft over the years. Good luck.


Ed Cregger

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Flew back a couple of days ago and decided to give the engine another go. Out of desperation, I flushed the carb again, put in an "R" plug and got some fresh fuel.

Took the advice here and reset all my needles to 1 1/2 turns out. Filled up the carb with fuel and surprise, surprise, the engine started on the 3rd or 4th attempt! It did seem to be running way too rich so I leaned it out. After about half a dozen starts and a little fiddling, I got it slightly rich - idleing at about 2,300 and peaking at almost 7000 with a Menzs 17 x 8 prop.

Fiddled a little more with the needles then I just couldn't get the engine started again!

So I'm thinking I have a carb/tuning problem.

When the engine first started, there was fuel all over it. Then as it came on tune, it started real easy. I couldn't really flood the cylinder even with fuel dripping out the carb. The first time I got it started, I resorted to squirting fuel directly into the carb.

Thereafter, each time I started it, I did notice that the engine would be starting a little lean (very high rpms), then seem to ease slightly as it got more fuel through the carb. I figure the engine is getting air and heat (cuz the plug is sparking), so it must be that its not getting enough fuel to run.

So I'm guessing the engine, EI and spark plugs are ok, but there's something amiss with my carb that doesn't allow fuel through properly.

Am I on the right track? Thanks.

ez-e

DID YOU TRY RESETTING THE NEEDLES BACK TO 1 1/2 TURNS OUT?
AND WHEN YOU MAKE YOUR ADJUSTMENT ON THE NEEDLES YOU ONLY TURN THEM 1/8 OF A TURN.

I KNOW YOUR NOT SUPOSE TO DO IT BUT I TURN MINE WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING SO I CAN HEAR THE SOUND
OF THE ENGINE AS I TURN THE NEEDLE

ONCE IT IS STARTED I PUT THE THROTTLE ALL THE WAY UP AND ADJUST THE HIGH NEEDLE TILL I HEAR WHAT I LIKE
OR WHEN THE RPMS ARE WHERE THERE SUPOSE TO BE.I TURN ONE WAY IF SOUNDS BAD I GO THE OTHER
THEN I BRING THE THROTTLE BACK DOWN AND CHECK THE TRANSITON FROM LOW THROTTLE TO HIGH
BY MOVING THE THROTTLE QUICKLY FROM LOW TO HIGH TO SEE IF THE ENGINE WILL CUT OUT.

IF IT CUTS OUT I ADJUST THE LOW NEEDLE UNTIL IT STOPS DOING THAT.

I AM FAR FROM BEING AN EXPERT BUT THAT IS WHAT WORKS FOR ME.

ALSO YOU CAN CHEK YOUR DIAPHRAMS AND SEE IF THERE AL IN GOOD CONDITION

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Thanks ez-e. Think I got the points you mentioned covered.

Downloaded the Walboro user's manual and what a mine of information it is! Will try cleaning out the carb again before putting my spare one on.

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Hi everyone, just thought I'd provide a little closure to this thread.

After hours of tinkering with the engine and carb, I caved in and got a new EI unit shipped to me. Just received it last week and it did the trick. Guess I learnt that just because the EI produces a spark doesn't mean that it's working ok. The engine now starts and runs as good as before. Going to fly it tommorrow, but for what its worth, the SPE 26 seems a decent engine. A little low on power perhaps, but I think you just can't beat the price!

One little note for those in warmer climates. The recommended (in previous posts) 1.5 turns on both needles were too lean for my conditions - the engine would pop on prime but wouldn't run or run with difficulty. Showed similar signs as a glow engine with the needles too lean. I started with 3 turns out and leaned in from there. Tuning seems pretty easy and I'm getting a clean transition and decent idle. Will know for sure once its airbourne.

Thanks again for all who took the time to try and help me out.

gkm41

My Feedback: (4)

Can I ask what voltage you are running the ignition on? I have mine on 4.8 volts right now but was wondering if it really should be running on 6 volt.

efish

My Feedback: (5)

Hi GKM, I run my EI off a regulator. Tried both 5v and 6v (jumper selected and volt meter checked) and decided that I didn't really see a difference in performance. Did a few test runs with a 4 cell NiCd pack too.

If you read the instruction manual, I think the required power supply range is stated as being from 4.8v to 18v, so I guess anythig from a 4 cell NiCd through to an unregulated 4S LiPo pack would, at least in theory, be workable.

Short answer - if you're running ok with the 4.8v, I wouldn't bother changing anything.

gkm41

My Feedback: (4)

Yes, guess you are right, seems to run pretty good on the ground, I haven't put her up yet, but been wondering if a little more power would be a good thing, I was going to make up a 5 cell pack for it or use a lipo pack..... Lipo would be nice and light..... I got my engine used, don't think it had been run more then a couple of times but I didn't get a manual with it so I was wondering about what everyone else was doing for a pack.