Leroy Gardner

Hey! some of you guys should be ashamed of your selves. These forums are for helping others learn reguardless of how stupid a question may sound to some of the smart asses that can't help themselves let alone others. Matt your not alone when it comes to a need to know. Transition from nitro to gas is a big jump to many of us and I'm one of them. Only the stupid don't ask. so ask away, there are hundreds of people here willing to help, baring a few butt heads.[>:]

Matt

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i'm okay... i just need other opinions besides my own sometimes..expecially for gas.

vertical grimmace

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I would like to reiterate what 804 has stated here. Many will argue about how they have never had a problem with a Dubro or whatever other brand stopper tank. It always ends up that they are not assembled correctly. BUNK! The problem is, the stoppers do not like the Ethanol in the gas nowadays. I have never been able to get a stopper tank to work with gas. Believe me, this will cause you no end of troubles.
The Bennet style of tank is superior and the only way to go. If you do a search for Nalgene bottle on the internet, you can find any shape or size you want for cheap. Like $2.00 a bottle. The screw on cap never leaks.

Tired Old Man

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Sorry Vertical G, But I must completely disagree with you.

There is no doubt that I have used a lot of Dubro and Sullivan tanks in gas applications over many years and the only time I've had a problem was when I used the incorrect stopper for the application or the early Sullivan stopper types. I still won't use a Sullivan stopper but I have no qualms about using a Sullivan tank. If you use the wrong stopper problems are guaranteed. if you use the right one they seal correctly for years. You don't even need a any fuel barbs if you use the correct sized fuel line and zip tie the connection points inside and outside of the tank. If you have a fuel line splice or connection anywhere it needs a zip tie.

As for "barbs" No need to buy them should you desire them. Simply rough up and clean the brass tube and wrap the tube with one or two strands of copper wire. A piece of a paper clip will do as well. Solder that onto the tube and you just made a barb for less than a penny that will work just as good and last as long as any commercially manufactured part at the hobby shop. You still need a zip tie. A barb is only a bump in the road without a zip tie. Air leaks happen around barbs too, which is another reason for the zip tie.

Many people feel they need a larger fuel line to supply a gas tank because it's a gas engine. Wrong!! a 3/32" line will adequately feed a 150cc engine throughout it's rpm range. Guess which line fits the brass tank tubes the tightest? Might have to warm it up a bit (boiling hot water) before sliding it on but the small line is better for the job. Many more don't understand there are several grades of tygon fuel tubing, and that the line provided in gas tanks is one of the lowest grades. That includes the Bennetts. They become quite stiff and generally swell a little upon first contact with gasoline.

I also use Bennett tanks and know they have an issue unique to them. The hole you drilled in the cap for the outlet nipple eventually generates radial cracks starting at the nipple that will eventually leak. Best take a look at that once in awhile.

My opinion, but a very large cause of gas engine newbies having set up problems is their lack of experience and understanding of what works in gas, and what won't transfer over from glow experience. That includes equipment use in areas of the plane aside from the engine. Then there is a problem of newbies listening to advice given them by other newbies. That's like the blind leading the blind, and both will sooner or later walk off the same cliff.

Rcpilot

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I still use DuBro tanks with the brown gasoline stoppers. I've NEVER had a fuel leak from a stopper in 12yrs of flying toy airplanes. I don't use barb fittings either. I use neoprene fuel lines INSIDE my tank and I use Tygon OUTSIDE my tank.

I will not use a Benet tank for the reason TOM described above. The cap eventually breaks down where the fitting screws in - then it leaks.

I will not use a Sullivan tank because I've had 2 of them split open and soak the inside of GLOW planes in the past. Not about to make that mistake again with a gas powered plane that costs 3x as much as the glow plane. Once you get fuel on balsa - it's a PITA to get it out.

I take my tank out every 2nd season and put in a new stopper and lines. Ethanol doesn't bother me one little bit. I'd rather spend $1.45 on a new stopper every other season than worry about ethanol eating my stopper and causing a leak. I don't know if thats true or not (ethanol rotting stoppers) because I've just never had those kinds of problems. I also replace my batteries every season. Batteries for a 50cc gasser cost me about $50. One for the ignition and one for the RX. $50 every season for a fresh battery pack might be overkill to some of you - but it sure is cheap insurance to me. Oh, I know you have to cycle them 4 or 5 times to break them in - but ya see, I do all this in March or April before the flying season actually starts. I'm drinking beer when I cycle my batteries and watch it snow. Doesn't inconvenience me at all. You change the oil in your car - don't you? You put a new fuel filter on your car and change the tranny fluid, don't you? Air up the tires on your snow blower? Change the oil in the lower unit of your outboard motor? Why would anybody expect a model airplane to fly season after season with the same $20 battery and $.02 cent fuel lines? It's called MAINTENANCE.

Checklst

I agree with T.O.M on this one, the only stopper that gave me trouble also was the early black gas Sullivan, had 2 leaks on the same plane with those (crap) stoppers. I only use DuBro gas red stoppers for years now.

Gas or ethanol does not break down the DuBro or the plastic tanks I have used for years. Down hear in GA we have has ethanol in the gas supply for the 10 years I have lived hear.
I think some rubbers had a problems with Ethanol in the early years(like 15 years ago) but most MFG's of gas engines updated fuel lines, gaskets,.... ect long ago to handle ethanol.

I will try the copper wire barb method TOM describes........sound like a good idea to me...............so far I have just used a nail punch to give a vary vary slight taper to the end of the brass tube and put a zip or twist wire behind the taper. I always use the small line in all my gas or glow application, it just holds great even if you forget the ties.

Matt

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'Tired Old Man' I guess i'm sort of a newbie at gas, but i already got a very old style gas airplane to fly that was given to me. And it's on PCM. And now that i have the bugs worked out, i never have a problem with it anymore. So i'm just looking for more advise just in case i missed something. And it looks like i have everything down on what to do from listening to you guys.

JoeAirPort

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The 3/32" line is a little hard to get on the carb inlet and also on a Walbro felt clunk. They have pretty large fittings. Anybody have problems getting the 3/32" fuel line on these areas?

Tired Old Man

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It's not easy for sure. What doesn't help is some manufactrurers use inlet and outlet pipe diameters much larger than they need to be. Because of that people use tubing sizes larger than the supply needs to be. Larger tubing will often not fit on a fitting as well as it could since the fitting may sized between tubing sizes. That generates air leaks for many that are not aware.

My point was that the smallest sized line that can be attached over an inlet/outlet is large enough to do the job adequately. Personally, I try to use a line size that many might consider a little small and heat the open in in very hot water, allowing it to stretch enough to slide over the fitting. That may be 3/32", 1/8", or whatever as long as it is the tightest possible fit.

I can't understand why people seem to read just about anything and apply the literal sense to it. Almost seems like one has to detail each and every step of a process and spec out every item involved, while attaching engineering drawings for reference, for people to understand. As if nit picking.

flatspinjim

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I've been using a water bottle tank for the last 6 months. They're simple, light and clear so you can see what's going on in the tank.

Matt

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I found this, and i don't think the highlighted part is right. Shouldn't it be richer and richer instead of leaner and leaner? Please help.

"While breaking it in the needles will need lots of monitoring. You will find that you have to chase the needles around just a little because of the heat and the breaking in process. The 111's are like a quarter turn after every 4th flight and the 55's are not that bad but they will make the motor run leaner and leaner each flight for the first two gallons."

BarracudaHockey

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John, whats with the PM's, post the links in public so everyone can benefit.

BarracudaHockey

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Matt, when you get that engine pull the spark plug, if its a generic looking thing throw it in the trash, go to a lawnmower shop and get a CM6, if you dont have a gap tool ask them to set it to 20 thousandths.

I have that motor in a 50cc SBach and other than some issues I had before I nixed the junk plug, its run like a swiss watch.

The tuning guide that got posted already will serve you well.

Also make sure you get decent oil, I prefer Royal Purple two stroke, you can also use Redline. Thats another (long winded) debate but a good oil will keep your motor running happy.

Matt

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Thank you for the information, i already have the engine, did exactly what you did, and it runs great(even though i'm still breaking it in). I did read over the tuning guide, but i found this other thing to and just wanted to know if what i pointed out was a mistake or not.

Zippi

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Matt,

I'm running my DLE 55 on my test stand just to tweak the needles before my Aeroworks 50cc S2 Sport Cub comes in. The manual tells you that the low end is set at 1 1/4 and the high end at 1 1/2. In my case this was not to far off. Of coarse there are no factory settings that you can just leave and expect to get the full power range out of your engine. I set both needles at 2 turns open. I started the engine and after it warmed up I ran it full throttle and with a tach I keep leaning the high needle until I reached max rpm. I then went to the low needle and I would advance the throttle fairly quick to see if I had a good transition from idle to full. Lean the low end about 1/8 at a time until you loose the good transition and then open it back up 1/8. Repeat the high needle process once again and your done.

Matt

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That's pretty much what i found on how to tune a dle 55 engine[8D]. But can i get an answer to my question please?

jedijody

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There is nothing right about what you quoted in post #35. Zippi's description is pretty much what I've written and verbally described countless times, if you start out that way your engine will tell you when it needs another tweaking but it won't be anything like the description in the quote. As the engine breaks-in and the ring gets a better seal it will require a slightly leaner needle setting mainly on the low needle. The high needle won't change much at all, if it does, it wasn't adjusted right in the first place.

kenhiraihnl

+1! My experience, exactly! Should be included in the "sticky" for everyone's benefit.
-Ken

digtman

Hi guys, does anybody know the amount of gap on a nkg spark plug for a dle? I dont see it anywhere in the instructions.

jedijody

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.018"-.020"

dave de

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would you be so kind to send me the link for prop & hub balancing also..... [email protected]